Author Topic: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS  (Read 13817 times)

drop247

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Re: POIS Paper Archive
« Reply #135 on: June 20, 2020, 01:19:48 PM »
Hey. Not sure if this has been posted. There is a study published on 15/06/20 by Japanese researchers. Conclusion is that NSAIDs are 'effective' in managing POIS.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/cia2.12123

What is AD? Autoimmune disorder?

berlin1984

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #136 on: June 20, 2020, 03:21:40 PM »
If there is acronyms, they are usually explained at first usage. In this case:

Quote
In addition, he had suffered from moderate atopic dermatitis (AD)

Another trick for glimpsing studies: Read the last few sentences of an abstract for a conclusion:

Quote
Most of POIS patients had suffered from AD.1 COX pathways were reported to be regulated differently in AD patients than in healthy volunteers.5 It is suggested that the systemic regulation of COX responses causes the symptoms of POIS, especially in AD patients.

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Muon

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #137 on: June 20, 2020, 03:50:47 PM »
They are refering to this paper: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S109888231300021X

"We conclude from this study, that in PBMCs from AD-patients in comparison to healthy volunteers, a systemic down-regulation of LOX- and COX-responses occurs to generally reduce eicosanoid/docosanoid synthesis during the current allergic inflammatory status."

From POIS paper: "Most of POIS patients had suffered from AD.1 COX pathways were reported to be regulated differently in AD patients than in healthy volunteers.5 It is suggested that the systemic regulation of COX responses causes the symptoms of POIS, especially in AD patients."

So the body downregulates COX in AD? Why do POIS symptoms decrease when you downregulate it even further? Doesn't make sense. Release of cytokines, which are able to upregulate COX, in combination with lipid production/release sounds more logical to me for this POISer.

hurray

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #138 on: June 20, 2020, 04:34:34 PM »
I'm a bit sceptical that an NSAID would have such a major effect on POIS symptoms.

https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.8900

That's the only mention of Diclofenac I could find, and Green claimed it only reduced his POIS symptoms by 20% or so. It's great to see new POIS research, but we should bear in mind that this paper only deals with one patient.

demografx

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #139 on: June 20, 2020, 11:39:21 PM »
hurray, exactly, a sample size of one is hardly convincing!
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 12:59:07 AM by demografx »
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

berlin1984

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #140 on: June 21, 2020, 01:57:50 AM »
I'm a bit sceptical that an NSAID would have such a major effect on POIS symptoms.

And IMHO that's only working around the cause, not curing it (whatever the cause might be).

From Wikipedia:
"It is believed to work by decreasing the production of prostaglandin.It blocks both cycloxygenase-1 (COX-1) and cycloxygenase-2 (COX-2)." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diclofenac


From Wikipedia about Sexual Headache:
"Case series have found indomethacin and beta blockers to be successful in treating these headaches. Propranolol, Bellergal, and triptans have also been used with success. Anecdotal and indirect evidence suggests a trial of magnesium supplementation may improve symptoms (in subjects with known or suspected low Mg levels)."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_headache

In our forum Indomethacin is proposed (see search function), which is has a more "pronounced selectivity towards COX-1"
https://www.emedexpert.com/compare/nsaids.shtml

But according to the POIS study Celecoxib (more COX-2) was also effective. So maybe it doesn't matter.


About the AD, nanna1 writes:
5. You wrote that you were hoping to resolve your neutropenia by following the immune competence therapy. Have you had any tests done afterwards? Has there been any change in your neutrophil count?
  The neutrophil count is a test that I should do. During the time I was boosting the immune system with supplements, I was monitoring my acne (face) and eczema (foot). Acne usually occurs when bacteria enters the skin. Then white blood cells (neutrophils) leave the blood vessels and invade the skin to attack the infection. The white blood cells are part of what give pimple their white color. I used to get acne/pimples in the days following orgasm as one of my POIS symptoms. As my acne cleared up, that gave me evidence that my neutrophil function had normalized. Certain foods (chocolate, dairy, high-sugar) that used to give me acne, no longer do.

  I also used to have eczema on the heel of my foot. This was not associated with orgasm or any related activity. Both the acne and eczema that I have dealt with since I was a teenager have cleared up. And I never get acne now, no matter what junk-food I eat :). Side note: I did use tea tree oil on the eczema also.

  These are indirect (and free) measures of neutrophil activity. But I've mainly been avoiding spending money on more medical test.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2020, 02:39:23 AM by berlin1984 »
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Clues

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #141 on: June 21, 2020, 03:04:14 AM »
I'm a bit sceptical that an NSAID would have such a major effect on POIS symptoms.

Same here, hurray. Be careful everyone! I personally believe that I and most likely many other POISers have some form of mast cell activation disorder, which is intimately tied to gut health. Long-term use of NSAIDs can mess with your gut, so you may be trading away your long-term gut health for some quick relief if you go heavy on the NSAIDs. Some research here and here.
Steam Group -- come hang out :)

Nas

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Re: POIS Paper Archive
« Reply #142 on: June 21, 2020, 04:17:15 AM »
Hey. Not sure if this has been posted. There is a study published on 15/06/20 by Japanese researchers. Conclusion is that NSAIDs are 'effective' in managing POIS.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/cia2.12123

Haha, I really like how Waldinger's (RIP) first paper set the criteria for testing, and when ever researchers try to build on it they instantly find that there is no detectable IgE for semen in patent's blood.
Also, since many of us don't really have physical symptoms, it's most likely the reason why NSAID's don't work for us. NSAID's only mask the inflammatory symptoms without addressing the underlying source.

Muon

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #143 on: June 21, 2020, 09:19:39 AM »
I'm a bit sceptical that an NSAID would have such a major effect on POIS symptoms.

https://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6576.8900

That's the only mention of Diclofenac I could find, and Green claimed it only reduced his POIS symptoms by 20% or so. It's great to see new POIS research, but we should bear in mind that this paper only deals with one patient.

I have seen more POISers over the years reacting positive to NSAIDs, also seen a few that got adverse reactions from it. I don't consider this paper research though, it's not that they investigate the underlying cause. It's more like a clinical report plus. NSAIDs are often used when one suspects inflammation. Conclusion states that it's effective, how effective (% of POISers)? The latter is impossible to know based on case reports.

I get the impression people are waiting for something that works for most POISers. If a mast cell disorder is at the root of POIS you probably won't find any since the cell behaves in diverse ways. Many of the 'treatments' which were succesful for people have in common that they are able to interact with mast cells directly and/or suppress downstream mediator effects.

Also, since many of us don't really have physical symptoms, it's most likely the reason why NSAID's don't work for us.

I suspect NSAIDs don't work for most, because of the variety of pro-inflammatory profiles in POISers. But this argumentation could be applied to other medication as well. Multiple inflammatory mediators might be involved in people that react partially to meds.

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=nl&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=atopic+dermatitis+mast+cell+&btnG=
« Last Edit: June 22, 2020, 04:41:09 AM by Muon »

Quantum

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Re: POIS Paper Archive
« Reply #144 on: June 21, 2020, 05:33:10 PM »
Hey. Not sure if this has been posted. There is a study published on 15/06/20 by Japanese researchers. Conclusion is that NSAIDs are 'effective' in managing POIS.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/cia2.12123

What is AD? Autoimmune disorder?
AD, in the article referred to, =  Atopic dermatitis    see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atopic_dermatitis
You are 100% responsible for what you do with anything I post on this forum and of any consequence it could have for you.  Forum rule: ""Do not use POISCenter as a substitute for, or to give, medical advice" Read the remaining part at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=1.msg10259#msg10259

Muon

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #145 on: June 22, 2020, 04:38:22 AM »
Where are the patients with GI tract complaints in Reisman's paper? It doesn't appear in table 2, why?

demografx

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Re: POIS Paper Archive
« Reply #146 on: June 22, 2020, 03:06:23 PM »
Hey. Not sure if this has been posted. There is a study published on 15/06/20 by Japanese researchers. Conclusion is that NSAIDs are 'effective' in managing POIS.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/cia2.12123

Thanks, quikot, sent to POIS Research Team.

quikot, I sent your post above to the POIS Research Team. They appreciated it: “ Interesting – and good to keep on track of the newest work. Thanks Demo!”

And thanks to everyone else (Quantum, Muon et al) who posted about it!
« Last Edit: June 22, 2020, 09:03:28 PM by demografx »
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

drop247

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Re: POIS Paper Archive - a list of scientific articles about POIS
« Reply #147 on: June 22, 2020, 09:28:07 PM »
Thanks Quantum.

quikot

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Re: POIS Paper Archive
« Reply #148 on: June 23, 2020, 05:51:55 AM »
quikot, I sent your post above to the POIS Research Team. They appreciated it: “ Interesting – and good to keep on track of the newest work.

Glad to be of help!

demografx

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Re: POIS Paper Archive
« Reply #149 on: June 24, 2020, 10:29:26 AM »
quikot, I sent your post above to the POIS Research Team. They appreciated it: “ Interesting – and good to keep on track of the newest work.

Glad to be of help!

quikot, really appreciated!
Demo
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business