Author Topic: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread  (Read 216625 times)

Muon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
    • MCAD Thread
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #400 on: July 04, 2019, 09:35:11 AM »
I've checked my cortisol level. It shows a normal result.

Muon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
    • MCAD Thread
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #401 on: July 19, 2019, 08:00:59 AM »
Thank you for the serum immunoglobulin free light chain update Simon. Do you know whether you have done this while symptomatic? Disease/symptom severity is related to serum levels. It has a half life of around 6 hours I believe. It's probably unlikely that these are involved in POIS considering your data.
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2684.msg24995#msg24995

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Bioresonance results
« Reply #402 on: July 22, 2019, 12:27:44 PM »
Did a hormone-chart-test on a Bicom bioresonance machine today (7 days after NE-POIS).

Positive reaction (means I need more of theese):
- Cortisol
- Estradiol
- Noradrenaline
- Parathormon
- T3
- Substance P
- "Correcting hormonal inbalances"

Negative reaction (means I need less of theese)
- Tourine

« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 05:51:22 AM by BoneBroth »

Muon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
    • MCAD Thread
Re: Bioresonance results
« Reply #403 on: July 22, 2019, 01:13:46 PM »
Did a hormone-chart-test on a Bicom bioresonance machine, 7 days after POIS (NE).

Positive reaction (means I need more of theese):
- Cortisol
- Estradiol
- Noradrenaline
- Parathormon
- T3
- Supstance P

Negative reaction (means I need less of theese)
- Tourine

I don't take these measurements seriously. It's pseudo science in my eyes.

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #404 on: July 22, 2019, 03:29:50 PM »
Sadly to say, but with that ridiculed attitude (demografix making-fun-of-alternative-medicin image), I suddenly realise three things:

1. If those comments by any means reflects the major driving forces in this forum, the prospects for an advancement in the search for a POIS cure here, for me suddenly seems hopelessly far away.
2. If the tentacles of Big Pharma (wich are recognized by such inscientific outbursts), as with almost all other disease-associations, also reaches inside this still free-thinking forum, you can all kiss the POIS-hope goodbye forever, just like with cancer, arteriosclerosis and all other endemic diseases that has become a "business with disease", rather then a genuine field of research for a cure (which, by the way, has been around for a long time, if not ever).
3. I might rethink spending time here, bouncing ideas and sharing my results open heartedly for everyone's common interest.

Please, at least keep such comments, if you really need them, in a separate thread.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." - Albert Einstein

Update 2019-07-23: I see that demografix image is obviously removed
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 05:55:29 AM by BoneBroth »

Muon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
    • MCAD Thread
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #405 on: July 22, 2019, 04:28:34 PM »
I think you are missing my point BoneBroth. These results are not results at all. I went to two alternative doctors who were using these machines and neither of those could explain the method they were using to me. I even question them further by asking some basic physical priniciples of electrical resistance and resonance. They did not have any knowledge about basic physics which the machine makes use of.

One of them told me my kidney was lowered. After a hospital visit and a scan later it turned out it wasn't the case. The method they are using is highly controversial and is not a standard for diagnostic testing. We are getting nowhere if standards are not kept high. I'm not here to ridicule you. Post what you want but I'm not taking those results seriously perhaps others will. These folks have created a market for themselves with their machines.

Quantum

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1734
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #406 on: July 22, 2019, 09:06:03 PM »
Sadly to say, but with that ridiculed attitude, I suddenly realise three things:

1. If those comments by any means reflects the major driving forces in this forum, the prospects for an advancement in the search for a POIS cure here, for me suddenly seems hopelessly far away.
2. If the tentacles of Big Pharma (wich are recognized by such inscientific outbursts), as with almost all other disease-associations, also reaches inside this still free-thinking forum, you can all kiss the POIS-hope goodbye forever, just like with cancer, arteriosclerosis and all other endemic diseases that has become a "business with disease", rather then a genuine field of research for a cure (which, by the way, has been around for a long time, if not ever).
3. I might rethink spending time here, bouncing ideas and sharing my results open heartedly for everyone's common interest.

Please, at least keep such comments, if you really need them, in a separate thread.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." - Albert Einstein


Hi Bone Broth,

I think all you miss is a little historic perspective about this thread to better understand the kind of reactions you got.  Originally, this thread was an idea of Muon.  The goal was to create a thread where could be gather medical tests results in one single place on the forum, rather than have them scattered across all threads.   Results like blood works, MRI, scan, etc...  The idea was clearly to gather here the results obtained through mainstream medical science.   There was an intent to make them more available for scientific analysis of POIS.  this is why it is in the Research board of the forum.

However, this does not mean at all that this forum is not open to alternative treatments and alternatives ideas.  It is just that you have posted your results in a thread of the " Discussion/Communication Research" board, that is dedicated to officially recognized results, the kind you get from exams and tests prescribed by physicians and specialists.   There is another board on the forum called "General Alternative Causes and Treatments of POIS", at https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?board=7.0 .  I think this is where you should re-post about the results you had, and about the follow up you will do with these results ( I am not familiar with the test you mention, but it seems to be an alternative medicine test, not a test done by a physician in a hospital or a medical clinic). So, I suggest you start a new thread on this board, which is, if you consider the number of threads in it, a very popular board on the forum.

There is not one single position on the forum about alternative tests and methods.  You can have members who do not believe in those ( the answer you got from Muon shows that he does not give those any credits). There are members more open to hear about alternative methods, espacially to hear about actual results other members got from these alternative methods.  You are still free to think what you want, and others too.  We just make sure, as moderators, that all point of views are expressed in respect, and commented about in respect. 

Sorry for the confusion.  The title of this thread, which says "Medical results", may be clear for some, but not for everyone.  I hope this post will also help othersbetter understand about the purpose of this thread.

Thanks for your understanding.
You are 100% responsible for what you do with anything I post on this forum and of any consequence it could have for you.  Forum rule: ""Do not use POISCenter as a substitute for, or to give, medical advice" Read the remaining part at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=1.msg10259#msg10259

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #407 on: July 23, 2019, 04:36:43 AM »
"I went to two alternative doctors who were using these machines and neither of those could explain the method they were using to me."

Oh really! Muon, in most of our lifes we are taking decisions based on things that we cannot explain and is not scientifically proved. In fact 99,99% of the history of human development we have worked our life by solving problems without the need for any scientific method or peer-reviewed articles, and still here we are (now sicker then ever, despite western medicine). Even the most highly regarded and Nobel Prize rewarded physicist don't have a clue about the true nature of gravity and why it is pulling his body to the ground. He just knows that it does so, and can to a certain point describe it mathematically. Magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) are used at all hospitals and still you would get the same answer from doctor who uses that device: "Sorry, we cant explain why particles emit magnetic fields!" It's the same with bioresonance. The physics involved might not be completely understood.

But I do understand when someone, who has been serioulsy sick for decades, who went to mutliple of doctors, suddenly becomes well after a few bioresonance treatments. I understand when an animal who dont know that it is gettting treatment gets better. And this is happening daily! I've seen it, I work with those people! So if "doing what works" is the major guiding principle in our lifes, why should we dismiss it when it comes to our health? I tell you why. Because of money! Big Pharma is trying to brainwash the population to believe that we are not in control of our own health and that we should leave all decisions about that in the hands of someone else - the MD doctors who are greatly financed and manipulated like punch dolls by the pharmaceutical industry and medical establishment, that was founded with support from the biggest quack, and snake oil salesman of all time - William Rockefeller, father of "Standard-oil" John Rockefeller who stated that "competition is a sin!".

Quantum, more then half of Bicom machines are used at state-funded hospital doctors around the world, and many in highly respected german hospitals. Then, who are we to decide that the outcome from this standard medical test is not suitable in this non-state-funded, non-scientific, non-doctor financed forum? Silly! This is medical tests result as any and if you dont like it, just keep it for yourself or ignore it, but don't downgrade it.

I'm not at all interested of what you laymen, or an occasional doctor, has to say about the reliability of other peoples medical test resuts. My focus is on finding an ease or cure of POIS, and I don't care whatsoever if such cure is based on "established science", "psuedoscience", folk remedy or plain wizardry. The focus is on getting well and trying to solve the POIS-puzzle by all means.

So I would recommend that we focus on this and stop taking the high moral, excluding some medical tests and not others. As an open-minded, alternative thinking member I prefer taking into acount all tests and judge them myself.
   
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 08:10:05 AM by BoneBroth »

Muon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
    • MCAD Thread
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #408 on: July 23, 2019, 07:37:19 AM »
Then, who are we to decide that the outcome from this standard medical test is not suitable in this non-state-funded, non-scientific, non-doctor financed forum?
It's not a standard medical test. There is zero proof of the relationship between the position of the meter and the levels of substance P in your body.

This is medical tests result as any other.
No it is not. This is a critical thinking error on your side.

If you dont like it, just ignore it, but don't downgrade it.
I will ignore it but I do appreciate your intention to post results here make no mistake about that.

As an open-minded, alternative thinking member I prefer taking into acount all tests.
This isn't a test for these parameters period.

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #409 on: July 23, 2019, 08:05:36 AM »
If someone here publish an image of a MRI test (that is used on all hospitals), you also have to dismiss that image on the same grounds. There is not a single proof of how magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) works it its core. So likewise, if you ask any doctor who uses it they will give you the same answer as if you ask a Bicom doctor: "Sorry, science can't fully explain magnetic fields, we dont know how this device works in it's core, but ovbiously the end results works for the patients, and that is all that matters".

My MD-doctor even dismissed a 200 dollar do-it-at-home testosterone blood and saliva test that I ordered from respected ZRT laboratory (earlyer published here), just because "we dont use such tests here, we only do our ordinary blood test (that show a spot value once in a day). I mean where should we draw the line? "This isn't a test for these parameters period.". What? Are you the one who knows and decides such things, above the heads of others?

Dude! Let's not fall into the narrow perspective of main stream medical science. That road only leads to a never ending row of false hopes for cures. Have they ever found a true cure for any endemic disease though trillion dollars spent for decades of research? Will it be diffrent for POIS? Of course not. If the progress on this research field falls into the hands of the medical establishment, in 50 years from now, and after millions of dollars spended, there will at best be a FDA-approved drug that is still not a cure but merely a life-long symptom reducer with a bunch of new severe side effects added. That is how the medical machinery works, founded by John D Rockefeller (https://worldaffairs.blog/2015/10/20/how-rockefeller-founded-modern-medicine-and-killed-natural-cures/).

Sorry if I have been too lengthy about this in this thread about medical test results! The subject deserves a thread by its own.  :)
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 09:11:10 AM by BoneBroth »

Muon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2908
    • MCAD Thread
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #410 on: July 23, 2019, 09:07:33 AM »
MRI is a validated technique and results can be replicated by other MRI devices. Go the another Bicom doctor without telling that person your previous results and test the same parameters you will end up with different results. Or better do a mainstream medical test for the same parameters and again you will end up with different results.

demografx

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6280
  • All of us working together to defeat POIS!
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #411 on: July 23, 2019, 09:47:44 AM »

The subject deserves a thread by its own.  :)


You’re more than welcome to start one :)
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

Quantum

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1734
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #412 on: July 23, 2019, 09:48:25 AM »
Hi BoneBroth and Muon,

What I see is that your points of view are quite different, and I do not think you will reach an agrrement anytime soon.

Muon's definition of what is acceptable has mainstream medical exams and result is very conservative.  He will recognize what is already widely accepted by most of the MDs out there.

BoneBroth is far more open and more inclusive, and accept a treatment as valuable even if supported only by a limited number of MDs or clinic, and is still highly controversial for many MDs in general ( I do not know of this therapy, but a quick search shows that it is still controversial - see https://www.drweil.com/health-wellness/balanced-living/healthy-living/bioresonance-therapy-better-diagnostic-method/ ). 

There is no way we are going to draw a clear line, and you could both go on for eons and this test and that test and ths other test, and why it is valuable, or why it is recognised and why it is not.   I hope you will just let each other think as they choose too. 

It's okay of Bone Broth is more open to alternative or less recognized, newer methods.  It is also ok that Muon is more fund of widely recognized methods, more in line with the mainstream medicine.    Newer methods are not all deceptive, of course, and some will finally make it in the mainstream arsenal accepted by all doctors, once they get more tests and have been developed to a point where results are consistent and interpretation of those results is well established.   On the other side, not all mainstream medical methods and medication are part of a business model by Big Pharma or any other corporate powers, and many diseases are cured by conventional methods. 

For POIS, currently, there is no alternative method neither conventional method that is known to relieve POIS, let alone cure it.  All we have is the few empirical successes shared by our members.  So, guys, be patient, and let's just tolerate each others point of view.  And, if anyone has any success with any method, it will always be a good thing to share it on the forum.  From there, anyone is responsible to decide what is appropriate for himself to try or not try, and consult with his health professional about this.

As it is obvious that you will not agree with each other, I hope you can just agree that you disagree, and leave it at that :)
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 09:51:08 AM by Quantum »
You are 100% responsible for what you do with anything I post on this forum and of any consequence it could have for you.  Forum rule: ""Do not use POISCenter as a substitute for, or to give, medical advice" Read the remaining part at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=1.msg10259#msg10259

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #413 on: July 23, 2019, 09:57:43 AM »
Muon. Easy for you to say. Do you have some real evaluation about the statement "end up with diffrent results" on Bicom devices or is it just your own experience by a handful of trials? Bicom also treat the symptoms you know, so after one treatment the symptom might be gone, and therefore does not show up on another (or the same) Bicom device. Well, if you base this on your own (or some others) experience then my words would weight as heavy as yours when I say that my experiences are that diffrent Frequency analysis techniques do give me the same results.

And how can we know that the mainstream medical test is correct or correct interpreted? Two diffrent blood tests for cortisol will also end up way differently on THE SAME main stream laboratory, depending on at what time of the day you do it! Just because something is "main stream" doesn't mean that it is correct done or show correct values. On the contrary. Main stream methods develops slow and becomes outdated. Standard hormon test methodology are highly criticized and not used by true specalists in the area because they dont give any useful clues.

Take for example belgian MD doctor Dr Thierry Hertoghe who represent the fourth successive generation of physicians working with hormonal treatments since 1892 (after Eugene Hertoghe, former vice president of the Royal Academy of Medicine in Belgium, and Luc and Jacques Hertoghe, endocrinologists), president of the International Hormone Society (over 2 500 physicians), and of the World Society of Anti-Aging Medicine (over 7 000 physicians). Dr Hertoghe trust on saliva tests, 24-hour urine tests and he states that the main stream ACTH-stimulation tests for cortisol is beeing wrong administred at hospitals and therefore gives a false result: "Unfortunately, in most clinics, the test is done by injecting 250 microgram of ACTH, a huge overdose. Almost any adrenal glands, even weaker ones, will react to this overdose.". If we could get his attention on the POIS issue perhaps real progress would be made.

Update: I just saw Quantums wise words above which sums this digression from the subject up well. No I don't have any problem with agreeing on disagreeing with Muon, however what triggered me from the beginning was probably demografx's image that ridiculed alternative medicine. It's gone now so I rest my case and "looking forward" to a new horrible 7 days POIS week since last nights NE, canceling all plans for the weekend. Waiting for the next Nanna1 stack shipment, arriving too late, "life" goes on...
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 10:34:02 AM by BoneBroth »

demografx

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6280
  • All of us working together to defeat POIS!
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #414 on: July 23, 2019, 10:19:40 AM »

...demografx's image that ridiculed alternative medicine. It's gone now...


Sorry. I removed it as soon as possible so as to avoid conflict.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 01:46:26 PM by demografx »
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

Nas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1081
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #415 on: July 23, 2019, 12:05:51 PM »
It's really sad to see how POIS's desperation leads towards seeking alternative medicine and pseudo-science. I fully blame that on protocol restricted doctors; basically anything not written in their books is in their patient's head, leading them to seek out alternative medicine doctors who'll say yes to anything. But I guarantee, guys, that if we stick with concrete medicine we will figure this illness faster, than to rely on nothing explanations.

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #416 on: July 23, 2019, 12:43:33 PM »
There are no such thing as "alternative medicine doctors". There are just DOCTORS. Some are MD, some are ND, some are both MD and ND. And it's far more likely for a MD to transfer to "alternativ medicine" than a ND to transfer to main stream medicine (if it ever happens!) because it's a question of waking up from an incorrectly orthodox symptom approach (that hardly existed over 100 years ago) to a holistic, biochemical, functional way of thinking (that has been around for millennia). That process is never backwards.

There are most respectable MD-doctors, even Nobel Price winners that promotes certain fields of alternative medicine. And when they do it for a long time enough people start calling that main stream medicine! What? Something that is alternative medicine cannot "become" main stream medicine. It's still alternativ medicine! Alternative medicine is not a field of medicine anyway - it's just the collection name for a tousands ways of treatments that focus on self healing instead of the 20th century fabrications "symptom-removing" and "cut off". Orthodox medicine don't have knowlede about the bodys ability to heal itself, they are illiterates in this field, and if self healing from a disease with "no cure" happens in an ambulatory settings it's explained away with such things as "miracles" and "sunshinestories", or in worst case "oh, its your medicine that worked wonders, not the vitamin pill you which you happened to take simultaneously"

I guarantee you, Nas, that if you stick with "concrete medicine", whatever that is, you will NEVER figure out the cause and cure for POIS. Main stream medicine might have terrorised the earths pouplation during the last 100 years but it's leading to a dead end which more and more people start to understand, even MD's. There is no future for main stream, orthodox, school medicine more then an enourmous unnessesary suffering.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 12:47:07 PM by BoneBroth »

demografx

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6280
  • All of us working together to defeat POIS!
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #417 on: July 23, 2019, 12:49:06 PM »
I’d really like to be openminded, but “concrete medicine” saved my life - - twice: once with major (5-way) bypass open heart surgery and traditional meds, then major surgery and traditional meds for a deadly-serious diverticulitis attack. If I went **outside**  the “concrete medicine” route, I’m sure I’d be dead by now. I’ve seen it happen to others - - far too often. :(

POIS research from all our $funding is headed toward “concrete medicine” - - and most of us (we funded the upcoming research ourselves) couldn’t be happier with the prospect of a cure.

ps - traditional medicine via the endocrinology route helped my POIS enormously. Steadily for the last 10 years.

I’m not trying to put a total damper on alternative routes. If chanting & herbs (just an example!) can successfully treat someone’s POIS, I’m all for it.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 01:11:18 PM by demografx »
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

BoneBroth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #418 on: July 23, 2019, 01:48:37 PM »
That is a question of what come first - the chicken or the egg? If John Rockefeller never lay out the ground for state-funded medicine - where 99% of all people end up today when they get ill - your situation would have been much diffrent now. Then they would for example have found that you were going towards heart problem and diverticulitis much earlier and reversed that process by for example cellular medicine (nutrients). No by-pass needed. However, they would still offer by-pass operations for the very few that would still need that.

demografx

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6280
  • All of us working together to defeat POIS!
Re: Gather and Post Here Your Medical Tests Results - Discussion Thread
« Reply #419 on: July 23, 2019, 01:56:15 PM »
Not very convincing. But I respect your right to have your alternative views. Thank you.

And best wishes.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2019, 02:02:53 PM by demografx »
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business