Author Topic: POIS is gone!  (Read 23847 times)

Muon

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #80 on: February 21, 2021, 11:19:42 AM »
Well, about 4 months ago I came down with a salmonella infection and got quite sick. I had a fever for a few days and felt very miserable. I had diarrhea and lots of it. Whatever was coming out of me was black and disgusting, perhaps blood in the diarrhea. After I recovered from the fever the diarrhea persisted and I had to go on antibiotics (azithromycin) to kill off most of the salmonella.

Discussion:

Irritable Bowel Syndrome caused by MCAS? New report.

"A proportion of patients will experience SIBO after a severe bout of food poisoning either from Campylbacteor, E Coli, Shingella or Salmonella. These bacteria create a bacterial toxin called Cytolethal Distending Toxin (CdtB) with can lead to autoimmunity with anti-vincolin antibodies developing.

the anti-vincolin antibodies which cause a loss of function of the Migrating Motor Complex and also nerve damage which will result in bacterial overgrowth
"

Charles_b

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #81 on: February 21, 2021, 03:03:58 PM »
Oh man, Sorry to hear that John.  I still think it is gut related (especially since while on Pepto Bismol for two weeks I had zero symptoms, and you mentioned something similar.)


Will update once that experiment is complete.

Any update on this? I'm still getting significant benefit from Pepto-bismol while in a POIS state. I'm awaiting a breath test for SIBO to see if I have a problem with hydrogen sulfide.

I didn?t do the full two-week test due to life being a little crazy right now, but I did take two doses after O (each dose a couple of hours apart), and was able to sleep during a night that normally would have been awful for me.  Next day was a little rough, but I?d say it knocked the severity of symptoms down by 60%.

What Hydrogen Sulfide SIBO test are you using?  I?ve read that they didn?t exist for a long time but some new ones are under development.  I also am curious about this as high sulfur foods like broccoli absolutely destroy me (even in very small amounts).

drop247

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #82 on: February 22, 2021, 05:03:59 PM »

I didn?t do the full two-week test due to life being a little crazy right now, but I did take two doses after O (each dose a couple of hours apart), and was able to sleep during a night that normally would have been awful for me.  Next day was a little rough, but I?d say it knocked the severity of symptoms down by 60%.

What Hydrogen Sulfide SIBO test are you using?  I?ve read that they didn?t exist for a long time but some new ones are under development.  I also am curious about this as high sulfur foods like broccoli absolutely destroy me (even in very small amounts).

The TrioSmart SIBO breath test tests for Hydrogen Sulfide as well as Hydrogen and Methane
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 10:49:27 AM by drop247 »

BoneBroth

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #83 on: February 23, 2021, 09:27:16 AM »
John21, what was your diet composed of between the improvement and the setback?

Now, I always seem to get heavy POIS symptoms after periods of bloating and bad smelly gas. I think this happens when I eat more starch (potatoe, bread etc), milk, yoghurt, sugar/syrup, ice cream and some vegetables. In the beginning of this year I experiened the best period so far in my POIS history, and i think that is because of that my FODMAP-protocol was giving effects, in combination of a liver-detox-tincture. I think a healthy bile production is of very importance for killing off the bad bacteria! and when I have POIS the poop becomes yellowis - a sign of low bile (the liver gets inflamed during POIS and cannot produce as much bile).

I think many cases of POIS can be boiled down to the following:
1. Long time stress messes with the gut on many ways: It lowers stommach acid production (HCL). When less acid realeases in to the intestine the bad bacteria can grow. Stress also slows down the bowel movement which gives time for bacteria to grow and produce gas. Raw material for hormones cannot be absorbed in the upper intestine (Vitamin B12, Vitamin D, Vitamin A, Vitamin E, Iron, Vitamin B1 (Thiamine), Vitamin B3 (Nicotinamide/Niacin).
2. Food hight in carohydryte, starch, fruit sugar and sugar favour the bad bactera and aggravates the hormonal imbalances (yes, no fruits! except possibly small berrries).
3. Bad sleeping habits, sedimentary lifestyle and low sun exposure messes with the circadian ryth (watching computerscreens too late) and aggravates hormonal imbalances.
4. On top of this comes orgasm - the releasing factor for many POIS:ers. Orgasm create an inflammation (When you have hormonal imbalances there are not enought antiinflammatory substances beeing released on orgasm) that do much harm in the body: it weakens all organs but specifically the walls of the intestines so they leak and cause auto-inflammatory symptoms (POIS), it also adds to the vicous circle by weakening the enzyme producing organs so proteins are not beeing properly digested, it weakens the liver so there are not enough bile to surpress the bad bacteria in the upper intestine. Bile is essential for the detoxification of the liver, as well as for the digestion and absorption of fats and fat-soluble vitamins (A, D, E, K). Bile is required for vitamin A. Proper bile output is important for preventing SIBO. Bile also have an anti-inflammatory effects. A healthy liver make up to one litre of bile every day!

The sollution? Exactly what John21 did! Get rid of the bad bacteria and get on a diet that support the non-gas-producing bacteria (FODMAP or carnivore diet). This might have immidiate results. But you cannot go back to the "bad diet" before your gut has healed 100%, and that can only be accomplished be reducing the stress. I don't think you have to work with a multitude of supplements, pharmaeuticals or testosterone patches for handeling POIS if you do the other things. It will just clear out by it self. However, adding the missing vitamins/minerals might be a good idea, and any supplement that are good for the intestine, such as gutamine, aloe vera, bonebroth or mangosteen (there were some member here who reported improvement after trying mangosteen juice).
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 09:39:26 AM by BoneBroth »

Muon

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #84 on: February 23, 2021, 09:43:36 AM »
Poor genetics. Maybe get a breath test John.

Cluudee Disappear

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #85 on: February 24, 2021, 09:34:21 AM »
John21, what was your diet composed of between the improvement and the setback?

Now, I always seem to get heavy POIS symptoms after periods of bloating and bad smelly gas. I think this happens when I eat more starch (potatoe, bread etc), milk, yoghurt, sugar/syrup, ice cream and some vegetables. In the beginning of this year I experiened the best period so far in my POIS history, and i think that is because of that my FODMAP-protocol was giving effects, in combination of a liver-detox-tincture. I think a healthy bile production is of very importance for killing off the bad bacteria! and when I have POIS the poop becomes yellowis - a sign of low bile (the liver gets inflamed during POIS and cannot produce as much bile).

I think many cases of POIS can be boiled down to the following:
1. Long time stress messes with the gut on many ways: It lowers stommach acid production (HCL). When less acid realeases in to the intestine the bad bacteria can grow. Stress also slows down the bowel movement which gives time for bacteria to grow and produce gas. Raw material for hormones cannot be absorbed in the upper intestine (Vitamin B12, Vitamin D, Vitamin A, Vitamin E, Iron, Vitamin B1 (Thiamine), Vitamin B3 (Nicotinamide/Niacin).
2. Food hight in carohydryte, starch, fruit sugar and sugar favour the bad bactera and aggravates the hormonal imbalances (yes, no fruits! except possibly small berrries).
3. Bad sleeping habits, sedimentary lifestyle and low sun exposure messes with the circadian ryth (watching computerscreens too late) and aggravates hormonal imbalances.
4. On top of this comes orgasm - the releasing factor for many POIS:ers. Orgasm create an inflammation (When you have hormonal imbalances there are not enought antiinflammatory substances beeing released on orgasm) that do much harm in the body: it weakens all organs but specifically the walls of the intestines so they leak and cause auto-inflammatory symptoms (POIS), it also adds to the vicous circle by weakening the enzyme producing organs so proteins are not beeing properly digested, it weakens the liver so there are not enough bile to surpress the bad bacteria in the upper intestine. Bile is essential for the detoxification of the liver, as well as for the digestion and absorption of fats and fat-soluble vitamins (A, D, E, K). Bile is required for vitamin A. Proper bile output is important for preventing SIBO. Bile also have an anti-inflammatory effects. A healthy liver make up to one litre of bile every day!

The sollution? Exactly what John21 did! Get rid of the bad bacteria and get on a diet that support the non-gas-producing bacteria (FODMAP or carnivore diet). This might have immidiate results. But you cannot go back to the "bad diet" before your gut has healed 100%, and that can only be accomplished be reducing the stress. I don't think you have to work with a multitude of supplements, pharmaeuticals or testosterone patches for handeling POIS if you do the other things. It will just clear out by it self. However, adding the missing vitamins/minerals might be a good idea, and any supplement that are good for the intestine, such as gutamine, aloe vera, bonebroth or mangosteen (there were some member here who reported improvement after trying mangosteen juice).

I'm new here. After reading around, mainly on this thread but several others and suffering for YEARS (and having bad side effects yesterday), I tried two Pepto chewable tablets after reading around and my symptoms disappeared within the hour. This has never happened to me before. Never have I just been able to clear up what feels like 100% of my symptoms.

This whole thread and the quoted post I have here makes complete sense. I'm switching to Carnivore, I'll make a post about it later introducing myself.

I've got some Pepto, eggs, ground beef and hopefully some steaks from Costco. Let's see what we can do and make it last.

Edit: Meat was awful on my system, going towards low FODMAP with Huel Black and taking Pepto chewables once a day to maintain.
Final edit: Huel Black did not help. Have not kept up with pepto either.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2021, 03:50:59 PM by Cluudee Disappear »

John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #86 on: February 28, 2021, 11:08:56 AM »
John21, what was your diet composed of between the improvement and the setback?


I ate my typical diet, which I consider to be healthy: vegetables, greens, beans, grains, nuts, low meat, low added fat

John21

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Re: POIS is NOT gone!
« Reply #87 on: February 28, 2021, 11:13:55 AM »
Any way to change the subject in a post? I'd like to insert a "NOT", lol.

BoneBroth

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #88 on: February 28, 2021, 12:02:03 PM »
Beans and grains contains FODMAP, and many vegetables (potatoe, rice, pasta etc). Possibly that food repopulated your gut with the bad bacteria again and there also is some factor that allow them to do this, low bile, low stommach acid (stress). I belive POIS is pro-bad bacteria.

John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #89 on: March 05, 2021, 05:25:03 AM »
Beans and grains contains FODMAP, and many vegetables (potatoe, rice, pasta etc). Possibly that food repopulated your gut with the bad bacteria again and there also is some factor that allow them to do this, low bile, low stommach acid (stress). I belive POIS is pro-bad bacteria.

Interesting. I think my diet is healthy but I can see how it could fan the flames in an abnormal situation like low HCL. Niacin (well known in the POIS community) can apparently stimulate HCL production. I'm thinking I will try some digestive bitters before meals as a trial, as that is a gentle way to increase HCL. I have read that dandelion is one of the ingredients in bitter herb tinctures. That is interesting as I remember trying it in the past and feeling really well on it. If I remember right I only discontinued it because it eventually caused me to experience sore teeth. I know I eat too fast so I can work on that too as it can cause lower HCL and less than optimum digestion.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2021, 04:41:30 AM by John21 »

NumberNineLarge

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #90 on: March 13, 2021, 12:00:22 AM »
Hello John. Reading your post brought something to my mind. Why don't you try enemas or Shank Prakshalana. It would be interesting to see if it has any effect. As described in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISnnag8UOGw&ab_channel=LoveOpenly-GetYourIdealGirlfriendChallenge, maybe you've seen it before.

John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #91 on: March 13, 2021, 05:10:05 AM »
Thanks, I had watched that years ago but I forgot about it. I don't think I will do the enema but the vegetable only diet for a week or two might be an idea to try.

Wolf berry

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #92 on: March 13, 2021, 05:30:53 AM »
It seems my POIS is gone, hopefully forever.  I can explain how I believe it happened although I don't really understand what happened.  In my previous posts I explained how Pepto Bismol prevented POIS when taken before O. This made me wonder if maybe there was something in the gut that was happening  to cause the POIS symptoms. Well, about 4 months ago I came down with a salmonella infection and got quite sick. I had a fever for a few days and felt very miserable. I had diarrhea and lots of it. Whatever was coming out of me was black and disgusting, perhaps blood in the diarrhea. After I recovered from the fever the diarrhea persisted and I had to go on antibiotics (azithromycin) to kill off most of the salmonella. I started eating yogurt, kefir, and sauerkraut to try to re-establish a healthy gut microbiome. The diarrhea went away and my system normalized. But even now, almost 4 months afterward, it seems that my digestive system is different than it was before the food poisoning.  I used to be quite gassy of a person. I like to eat healthy and that always resulted in a lot of flatulence. But now eating the same diet I DO NOT have excessive gas! Also, it seems that my feces does not smell as bad as it used to, which is strange. Anyway, the main point is that since this event I have not had any POIS! I have recently had multiple Os and have had no difficulty. This leads me to wonder what the heck might have happened. Was there a "bad" bacteria causing the trouble somehow that got eliminated in the sickness/ antibiotics/ recovery? I may be wrong but my gut (bad pun) feeling is that the current lack of POIS is related to the sickness/recovery somehow. I don't suggest this "treatment" to anyone, is wasn't fun, but maybe it can shed some light on the cause of POIS.  Something to consider!

Congratulations!

John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #93 on: April 27, 2021, 05:02:21 AM »
Update:
I am once again having success! The following is an explanation of what I have recently tried. From my life experience I became convinced that the problem resides in the gut. Initially I benefited from consuming certain things like niacin, taruine, and then Pepto Bismol. Then, POIS went away entirely after I was sick with salmonella and was treated with antibiotics... and then it came back. So, I decided to have a trial of supplements to eradicate whatever bacteria or virus or whatever might be living in me. I went on the assumption that my POIS was a reaction to h pylori or something like it. So I started a 3 week trial of supplements that kill h pylori.

Here is what I took for 3 weeks:
Mastic gum 400mg  2x/day
L-Glutamine 5g  1x/day
Caprylic acid 525mg 2x/day
Oregeno oil 180mg 1x/day
probiotic 1x/day

On occasion I sometimes included one of these:
Pepto Bismol (262mg tablet x2)
NAC 800mg
Taurine 1000mg
Vitamin C

Once the 3 weeks were complete I tested it and had no symptoms after O. Since discontinuing this stack I started taking Turkey Tail (1/4tsp 2x/day) which is supposed to be good for the gut, and also I have kept taking the caprylic acid. Two weeks later and I still had no symptoms after O. So I do think that something worked and that it is gut related in my case. Perhaps my system will revert as it did previously, time will tell whether I have to continue to supplement. If I had to guess I think that the mastic gum might be the most significant one. I originally started with 3/day mastic but backed off to 2/day because it constipated me somewhat. Some of these supplements are quite pricey, I think the mastic gum was the most expensive.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2021, 02:42:43 PM by John21 »

Charles_b

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #94 on: April 27, 2021, 10:11:28 AM »
That?s great news!  How often are you taking the Pepto Bismol?  If I take it for a week or two daily I have no POIS symptoms, but if you are taking it sparingly with these other supplements and still having success? that would be a great sign, and yet another data point hinting towards a gut related cause.

I have tested positive for H Pylori twice, and most recently tried Pylera with PPIs (which had fairly awful side effects), but I still have horrible heartburn even after treatment, so I?m wondering if it didn?t resolve.


John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #95 on: April 27, 2021, 04:43:06 PM »
Charles, I only took the Pepto Bismol a few times as I remember. I added it for a couple of days because I read that it can counter h pylori. I guess I was hesitant to stay on it because it was sometime after using it that I came down with the salmonella last fall. I know that doesn't really make sense as I don't know of any reports of it killing good bacteria, but that was my fear. Perhaps an anti-h.pylori strategy should include PB daily.

Charles_b

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #96 on: April 28, 2021, 08:47:52 AM »
Ah ok, makes sense.  What probiotic did you use?  I?m trying to find a good one, as some make me feel markedly worse.

hapl

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #97 on: April 28, 2021, 10:10:43 AM »
Yes, I'd also like to know which probiotic as I've gotten varying results.

Also a bit more detail on if you took things at any specific time? Like the Pepto - I'd be worried it would affect digestion? And any particular brand of mastic gum, or just any reliable company?

John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #98 on: April 28, 2021, 05:44:29 PM »
Quote
Yes, I'd also like to know which probiotic as I've gotten varying results.

Also a bit more detail on if you took things at any specific time? Like the Pepto - I'd be worried it would affect digestion? And any particular brand of mastic gum, or just any reliable company?
  • The probiotic is Jamieson 10 billion.
  • I just generally took supplements at breakfast and at supper.
  • I don't think Pepto would affect digestion but I'm not really sure.
  • The mastic gum is AOR Mastica Chios 400mg. Yes, I would think that if it is a reliable company they should be quite similar in quality/ effectiveness.



John21

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Re: POIS is gone!
« Reply #99 on: May 15, 2021, 05:16:26 PM »
Still zero symptoms after orgasm. I am confident that I fixed something.    :)