Vitamin A toxicity as The Root Cause Of Autoimmune Diseases?

[Ali Hamza]

I have read the research of an Engineer and Geologist whose name is "Grant Generux", who has treated his autoimmune disease by finding the root cause. His research is very interesting. He explains single root cause of many autoimmune diseases and POIS could be one of them. I highly recommend POIS researchers and forum members to look into his work. He explains and proves how "Vitamin A" toxicity is the root cause of autoimmune diseases. This is a big milestone in the field of medical research. I am pasting the book link "https://ggenereux.blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/extinguishing-the-fires-of-hell2.pdf" here, please download and read his astonishing work in the medical field.
Next he wrote two more books on autoimmune diseases, I highly recommend to read them.
https://ggenereux.blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/PoisoningForProfits.pdf
https://ggenereux.blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/BreastCancer.pdf

Next, I am presenting here another doctor Dr. Garret Smith whose research could be very useful in linking the root cause of POIS. So, I highly recommend all of my POIS members to look into his research. I am pasting here the link to his discussion forum.
https://nutritionrestored.com/blog-forum/

[berlin1984]

Hi Ali,

I've edited your post to make it less sensationalist :-)

Is there any reason for you to believe that Vitamin A is involved in POIS specificially?
Because just claiming it is involved in other diseases does not make it relate to POIS.

We don't even know if POIS is Autoimmune or something else or a combination of things.

Did you get your Vitamin A levels tested?

[BoneBroth]

Well, every vitamin, mineral, and even water is the cause of toxicity if taking too much too long time. But in enought amonths they are essential for life.

[Ali Hamza]

Hey Berlin,
That's what I want to make you understand, there is nothing like autoimmune, our immune system attacks our bodies on a very reasonable purpose.
Please don't judge anything quickly based on prior knowledge, first look into the research, read this book https://ggenereux.blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/extinguishing-the-fires-of-hell2.pdf, then use your analysis, then we can understand each other.
And to understand lab tests, we need to understand the complexities of body and its tissues. For example, we have observed many times that people labs are fine but they feel very bad and sometimes they lab tests are not good but they feel very well. This is because understanding labs tests is very critical. You can further investigate this by studying and understanding this article https://nutritionrestored.com/blog-forum/topic/the-limitations-of-blood-tests-old-blogpost/

[Ali Hamza]

All the experienced members of the forum are required to elaborate this work and give their valuable suggestions after reading this research.
I request all the members, please first read the book, expand your notion of thinking regarding this research, and let's try to discuss this problem here, I am not proposing and presenting any theory here until most of us read this research https://ggenereux.blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/extinguishing-the-fires-of-hell2.pdf, after reading this we can understand each other. Practically I personally have applied some techniques from this research and those have proven successful specifically in dealing with mental health issues but I am not going to list anything until solid evidences of its effectiveness are found.

[Journey]

I doubt my POIS is autoimmune - although a recent high sensitivity C-Reactive Protein test showed 3.0, I have seen many biohackers and so on have such CRP levels

I do not have traditional autoimmune or mast cell activation disorder symptoms although I have had a few times on the nose/cheeks that white flake seborrheic dermatitis thing I do not really have other autoimmune disorder signs - my POIS mostly is cognitive/neurological based

[Quantum]

All the experienced members of the forum are required to elaborate this work and give their valuable suggestions after reading this research.
I request all the members, please first read the book, expand your notion of thinking regarding this research, and let's try to discuss this problem here, I am not proposing and presenting any theory here until most of us read this research https://ggenereux.blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/extinguishing-the-fires-of-hell2.pdf, after reading this we can understand each other. Practically I personally have applied some techniques from this research and those have proven successful specifically in dealing with mental health issues but I am not going to list anything until solid evidences of its effectiveness are found.

Hi Ali Hamza,

I understand that your intention is to help, but here are some considerations for you to ponder on :

1. If you carefully read the book of this guy, and read the disclaimers, he himself is not sure if his theory is valid, and what really helped him. 

2. Nowhere in his book did I see a mention of a blood test result about his vitamin A level, either before his no-vitamin-A diet or after.  When you talk about vitamin A toxicity ( hypervitaminosis A), for hundreds of pages, you should have your blood level tested, at the least.  He does not even mention retinyl ester testing, which is more accurate still than Vit A blood level to identify hypervitaminosis A ( see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervitaminosis_A#Tests ).  That is a major flaw in his presentation.

3. POIS is not eczema, so no direct conclusions for POIS can be drawn from his self-experiment.

4. If this has been beneficial for him, this does not mean that it will be beneficial for others, even for those having the same health problem ( eczema) that he has.

5.  He challenged his health condition with food containing vitamin A, but I would have preferred to see him try a vitamin A supplement as a challenge.  This would have been more in line with his hypothesis.

6. Hypervitaminosis A is something real, but it comes only from ingestion of too much preformed vitamin A ( retinol ), like from too much fish liver oil or from too much liver from animal sources.  But you cannot have toxicity from veggies and fruits, which contains beta-carotene, a pro-vitamin A, not already formed vitamin A. The body will change beta-carotene to vitamin A only when needed, so it cannot cause toxicity ( I suggest you read this excellent article for details: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervitaminosis_A ).   In his book, Mr.Genereux seems to be oblivious to this fact and advises avoiding fruits and veggies, which is not good advice, considering what we know about their many benefits, and considering they cannot contribute to vitamin A toxicity.

The fact that this guy seems quite intelligent and is a prolific writer ( he obviously likes to take 12 pages to make a point that would need only one page, in my opinion), that does not make him a health professional.  He makes many guesses, that could be called "educated guesses", but that are not verified.  If you pile up guesses upon guesses, you get a very shaky hypothesis, in the end.

Vitamin A absorption can vary from one person to another, due to genomic differences.  Those who have a better absorption may need less vitamin A, but I am not convinced that a regular, balanced, diet could end up causing vitamin A toxicity.   If this occurred with a balanced diet, it would be a very particular case, and a genome sequencing of this individual would be appropriate to do, in order to look for any particular SNPs ( genomic permutations) that could explain this level of sensibility to preformed vitamin A.

This does not mean that he did not get better, but it may not be for the reason he thinks. For example, he mentioned he had a flare up from tomatoes, but as explained above, tomatoes cannot cause vitamin A toxicity,  the beta-carotene in them is just not changed into vitamin A ( in this case, he may have considered the effect of acidic and spicy foods on eczema, I think).  So, his hypothesis would need refinements and would need much more rigorous testing, and with many other subjects, not just himself.


Maybe it would be better to share some information about your own case, Ali Hamza.  Do you personally have POIS, and what symptoms do you have, and what have you tried up to now to relieve it ?  Also, if you tried any of what is presented in this book, what was it, exactly, and what level of relief did you get? For what symptoms? If you have good results, how long has it been since you have those results?  This kind of information may be of interest for our members here

[demografx]

Maybe it would be better to share some information about your own case,
Ali Hamza.  Do you personally have POIS, and what symptoms do you have, and what have you tried up to now to relieve it ?  Also, if you tried any of what is presented in this book, what was it, exactly, and what level of relief did you get? For what symptoms ? If you have good results, how long has it been since you have those results?  This kind of information may be of interest for our members here

Since 2007, the above Questions from Quantum have proven - - over and over - - to be the absolutely most helpful type of questions to be answered for our POIS community!

[Ali Hamza]

Yes I am a patient of pois disease and bad cognitive functions for about 5 years and feel a lot of bad symptoms(headache, sore throat, nasal congestion, flue, chest rashes etc.) after ejaculation.
Well according to the experiment done by the people and by myself,
Low Vitamin A diet or zero vitamin A diet will improve cognitive functions for the first 7 days then for some people its keeps improving and for some people they feel symptoms of their disease because they experience bad detox cycles. New theories suggest that autoimmune diseases are nothing but toxicity state in the body, so that in normal body processes lipids and cells used are not normal like before, now they have toxic substances in them. These toxic substances can be removed by proper functioning of the liver through diet changes and results can be seen from 6 months to 4 years depending upon the toxicity state.
The members here with cognitive issues can give it a try, more over if anyone wants to detox properly they can subscribe to this Liver detox program https://nutritiondetective.com/ , actually I am new to this stuff and I don't force any one to start this diet or subscribe to this program but I just want to mention these guys Dr. Garret Smith and Grant Generux have come with the new explanation for autoimmune disease, So Diseases like Lyme disease & Hashimoto's disease have been cured by Dr. Garret Smith Diet plan but it takes time from one to two years, I am new to this stuff I don't know it will work or not but as the time required for treatment of autoimmune diseases is years, I want to bring this thing into notice of people , I can't wait for years to notice results and tell people , I have already told people that they can start this journey here if they want to.   

[Quantum]

Hi Ali Hamza,

Thanks for sharing some details on your POIS story, this helps other members to relate to your posts.

I totally agree to the importance of liver detox.   Actually, I wrote a thread about it here, some years ago, to help members understand the essential roles of the liver, and how to detox it.  You can find this thread at https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2431.msg20521#msg20521 .  As I have written in this thread, liver detox did not eliminate POIS for me, but it sure reduced the length and severity of my POIS attacks in a significant way.  It also helped raise my general level of stamina.
I am still making myself those green smoothies I mention in that thread, and they are still very effective for me in maintaining optimal health.

[Ali Hamza]

Your idea of liver detoxification is great but method is wrong. The things you are using like green smoothies are again toxic for your liver especially for pois members. The diet you are using is needed to be reviewed. As you experience pois sometimes severe and sometimes less severe. It's because of diet. Unknowingly when you ate toxic things like green smoothies and some other things, you get severe symptoms otherwise you get less severe symptoms. Now you may be questioning that why I am saying green smoothies are toxic. It's because your liver storage capacity for Vitamin A is already filled, green smoothies and a lot of those things contain vitamin A, now when you ate these type of things liver can't store more vitamin, this vitamin starts to store in your other tissues, cells, lipids and other parts of the body. It may be stored in any part of the body. Now the vitamin A is at the place where it shouldn't be. I mean into the cells. When these cells are used up, retinol (vitamin A) stored in them is exposed which forces cytokine release and immune system starts to attack our own bodies and cells. I would recommend you should join liver detox program mentioned in my above post as it has come with advancements in foods with proper scientific evidences. Besides ignoring it, just give it a try, may be it opens new doors for us.

[Quantum]

Your idea of liver detoxification is great but method is wrong. The things you are using like green smoothies are again toxic for your liver, especially for pois members.

Hi Ali Hamza,

I am sorry to see that you share your hypothesis as if it was an absolute truth.  It would be more appropriate and more in line with the spirit of this forum to simply share what works for you, and let others decide what is best for them.
In my case, green smoothies allowed me to become healthier, including reducing my time for recovery from a POIS attack.   And, sure enough, there are a ton of well-constructed, proven studies showing the benefit of this kind of diet.  You could take a look at some of these, like the studies on the Mediterranean diet, and also the MIND diet.

Again, maybe, in some case, vitamin A toxicity ( hyperviaminosis A) may be present, but there are recognized test to screen it, like described in the wikipedia link I have shared earlier in this thread.  It appears that you ignored it, and prefer to give absolute credit to a man who does not seem to have the medical and nutritional credential , and neither clinical studies, to back his affirmations and offer hair analysis at big prices.

His hypothesis is going against all nutrition data known today.  Again, his hypothesis may be good in some specific cases, where the clinical tests have demonstrated hypervitaminose A.  But this surely does not allow you to tell me that my green smoothies are the wrong way to detox the liver and that everybody should listen to this man about  no-vitamin A diet.
And, above all, this site you refer to is a commercial site, which sells its own testing, for a high price.  And you also have to pay to get access to his program.  Sounds like your man is doing good business, there.  Do you have commercial links with the site?   I hope not, and you may be sincere and have been having good results, but in your enthusiasm about explaining and promoting this site and its detox method, you never talked about what it did for yourself.

Now, as a moderator, I ask you, from now on, to refrain to publicize this site, and just share your results and progress ( time to get better, current status, updates on YOUR progress, etc.).  If people want to join, they know how to contact you.  More than that will look like you work for them, and you will then be moderated because publicity for any method or website is not allowed here.

Thanks for your compliance and understanding.

[Ali Hamza]

Ok I got you, I will never ever mention this site and I will abide by the rules. I am sorry if you get me wrong on mentioning this site. From here and onwards I will only post my results, if somethings helps me.

[berlin1984]

Accutane (isotretinoin) is a form of vitamin A.
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=107

[BoneBroth]

But at the same time. Vitamin A deficiency:

"disrupts neutrophil development, increases inflammatory cytokine release by macrophages, and decreases the number of natural killer cells and their lytic activity. These disruptions and changes lead to a decrease in the body?s ability to eliminate infectious agents."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4810759/

However, syntetic vitamin A, in the Accutane, is much more potent then common vitamin A supplements and has probably a much higher toxicity.

[Quantum]

But at the same time. Vitamin A deficiency:

"disrupts neutrophil development, increases inflammatory cytokine release by macrophages, and decreases the number of natural killer cells and their lytic activity. These disruptions and changes lead to a decrease in the body?s ability to eliminate infectious agents."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4810759/

However, syntetic vitamin A, in the Accutane, is much more potent then common vitamin A supplements and has probably a much higher toxicity.

Absolutely, BoneBroth.

Isotretinoin ( Accutane) is highly toxic and is a dangerous teratogenic drug.  It stays allowed on the market only because no other treatment matches its efficacity in severe acne cases, in particular severe cystic acne cases.  Come up with a less toxic alternative that is as effective in bad acne cases and Accutane will be automatically banned. 

Isotretinoin is definitively not to be confused with vitamin A, even if they are related.   A 12 feet crocodile and an iguana are both reptiles... would you have any of the two in your living room ?   

[BoneBroth]

There has been better alternatives then Accutane for decades. Anyone with acne, in any form and any age, should watch Ben Fuchs Youtube series of the seven types of acne and how to eliminate them.