Castration, why did it work

[demografx]

Animus, I really appreciate that you and Quantum have taken a more detailed look at your POIS and how we might learn from your great success to possibly help other POISers! I’m sure it must have been very emotionally demanding for you to run through all the surgeries undergone, so I thank you and wish you once again a very wonderful and restful Holiday season!

[demografx]

Once again...
The Learning Channel's (TLC) feature TV presentation on Animus’ POIS:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6sdaR18vw1s

[demografx]

Everyone: I’m not at all suggesting that we all go out and do risky/expensive surgery. But let’s try & see if we can learn from Animus’ experience!
Demo

Since I had a part in promoting Animus’ POIS success story recently, I thought this might fit in with Quantum’s post, with italics to emphasize once again that
I’m not promoting surgery for POIS!

Animus’ expensive surgery was as costly as a POIS Research Grant. So - once again - let’s all try and learn from it. I think the detailed questions about Animus’ procedures that were stimulated by Quantum and others are exactly what I was hoping for!

Thanks, everyone.

Example of what I mean above: can we learn from Animus’ successful anti-POIS experience of
“dry ejaculation” (which Quantum rephrased as
“no semen = no POIS”) - -
in non-surgical terms?? Can meds produce that effect?

As Quantum points out, there are different POIS types. So, which type POIS might most possibly benefit from the “dry ejaculation” theory?

[aswinpras06]

Everyone: I’m not at all suggesting that we all go out and do risky/expensive surgery. But let’s try & see if we can learn from Animus’ experience!
Demo

Since I had a part in promoting Animus’ POIS success story recently, I thought this might fit in with Quantum’s post, with italics to emphasize once again that
I’m not promoting surgery for POIS!

Animus’ expensive surgery was as costly as a POIS Research Grant. So - once again - let’s all try and learn from it. I think the detailed questions about Animus’ procedures that were stimulated by Quantum and others are exactly what I was hoping for!

Thanks, everyone.

Example of what I mean above: can we learn from Animus’ successful anti-POIS experience of
“dry ejaculation” (which Quantum rephrased as
“no semen = no POIS”) - -
in non-surgical terms?? Can meds produce that effect?

As Quantum points out, there are different POIS types. So, which type POIS might most possibly benefit from the “dry ejaculation” theory?

The Mast cell activation theory clearly fits this.  The urinary tract is lined with extremely large number of  mast cells.  In pois sufferers this get activated by semen.  No semen means no mast cell degranulation.  Fits 100%

[Animus]

Animus, I really appreciate that you and Quantum have taken a more detailed look at your POIS and how we might learn from your great success to possibly help other POISers! I’m sure it must have been very emotionally demanding for you to run through all the surgeries undergone, so I thank you and wish you once again a very wonderful and restful Holiday season!

Thank you Demo. Wish you a Merry Christmas & happy holidays too!  To you & everyone on the forum.  Thank you

[aswinpras06]

Animus is our "Ultimate Hero and Champion."

What Animus has done 10 years ago is like climbing Mount Everest or reaching Moon for the first time.  I am not exaggerating.  No one will have the thinking and courage that Animus had.

Even now we all struggle with, finding out the cause and cure for the debiliating disease.
But he somehow correctly figured out, what is causing his problem.  Incredible isn't it to have done that some 10 years back.   

Thanks a lot Animus on behalf of all the poiser's.  Its a great lead and now others can learn from your experience without undergoing the enormous pains you've encountered in finding out the solution.

Biologics and new medicines are now discovered which may completely prevent the effect of semen on our urinary tract without undergoing castration.  So in the next few years we will get a cure.

Thanks once again for your invaluable contribution to our cause.

[demografx]

Animus is our "Ultimate Hero and Champion."

What Animus has done 10 years ago is like climbing Mount Everest or reaching Moon for the first time.  I am not exaggerating.  No one will have the thinking and courage that Animus had.

Even now we all struggle with, finding out the cause and cure for the debiliating disease.
But he somehow correctly figured out, what is causing his problem.  Incredible isn't it to have done that some 10 years back.   

Thanks a lot Animus on behalf of all the poiser's.  Its a great lead and now others can learn from your experience without undergoing the enormous pains you've encountered in finding out the solution.

Biologics and new medicines are now discovered which may completely prevent the effect of semen on our urinary tract without undergoing castration.  So in the next few years we will get a cure.

Thanks once again for your invaluable contribution to our cause.

Thank you, aswinpras.

[Animus]

Animus is our "Ultimate Hero and Champion."

What Animus has done 10 years ago is like climbing Mount Everest or reaching Moon for the first time.  I am not exaggerating.  No one will have the thinking and courage that Animus had.

Even now we all struggle with, finding out the cause and cure for the debiliating disease.
But he somehow correctly figured out, what is causing his problem.  Incredible isn't it to have done that some 10 years back.   

Thanks a lot Animus on behalf of all the poiser's.  Its a great lead and now others can learn from your experience without undergoing the enormous pains you've encountered in finding out the solution.

Biologics and new medicines are now discovered which may completely prevent the effect of semen on our urinary tract without undergoing castration.  So in the next few years we will get a cure.

Thanks once again for your invaluable contribution to our cause.

Aswinpras,   You are welcome, and Thank you for this...  Certain things came together for me at that time, that allowed me to do it...    We should not lose faith for an alternative.  It's Possible, perhaps, to repeat the surgeries which I did, but risky, expensive, and I tried to emphasize that there are many opportunities for complications along the way of the Surgical Route, which could make the situation worse...   It's a bit like an experimental procedure.
I think it's a good idea, now that we have the Scientific and Medical Assistance to do solid work on this, to wait to see what they can come up with.

But I think the theory that led me to do these surgeries... can possibly be used as a starting point of investigation. As a theoretical model.  One which we know has a positive outcome.  I guess the best case scenario, would be to find a drug which can be taken... which inhibits Semen Production.  That would be my first guess.  There are existing drugs, treatments out there which Inhibit Semen production, used to treat other illnesses. (radiation of the prostate, chemo drugs) if you google "inhibit semen production" that would be my starting point.

[aswinpras06]

Thanks Demo!

and

Thanks again Animus!

[demografx]

aswinpras, you’re most welcome!

[demografx]

...I think the theory that led me to do these surgeries... can possibly be used as a starting point of investigation. As a theoretical model.  One which we know has a positive outcome.  I guess the best case scenario, would be to find a drug which can be taken... which inhibits Semen Production. 

This is exactly the basis for my excitement!!

I can’t thank  you enough, Animus, for your spectacular early “Mt Everest” courage and now, for many of us (not necessarily all!) to help us see a possible way out!!

[demografx]

...if you google "inhibit semen production" that would be my starting point.

The first thing that popped up for me:

Chemotherapy drugs will inhibit sperm production and other medications such as spironolactone, cimetidine, nifedipine, sulfasalazine, colchicine, and oral ketoconazole can also negatively impact male fertility. Sep 10, 2019

[demografx]

The Mast cell activation theory clearly fits this.  The urinary tract is lined with extremely large number of  mast cells.  In pois sufferers this get activated by semen.  No semen means no mast cell degranulation.  Fits 100%

aswinpras, this was an eye-opener for me, thank you!

[Animus]

...if you google "inhibit semen production" that would be my starting point.

The first thing that popped up for me:

Chemotherapy drugs will inhibit sperm production and other medications such as spironolactone, cimetidine, nifedipine, sulfasalazine, colchicine, and oral ketoconazole can also negatively impact male fertility. Sep 10, 2019

Demo, This is GREAT! 
Thank you for this.  I think this is JUST the direction that POIS research can go in.
These drugs may work to inhibit semen production. So will radiation therapy. It is used commonly for the Prostate to treat cancer. It could be additionally used to treat the Testicles, and Seminal vesicles too.
This could be a very promising alternative to Surgery.

[Disaster]

...if you google "inhibit semen production" that would be my starting point.

The first thing that popped up for me:

Chemotherapy drugs will inhibit sperm production and other medications such as spironolactone, cimetidine, nifedipine, sulfasalazine, colchicine, and oral ketoconazole can also negatively impact male fertility. Sep 10, 2019

I wonder how accurate that list is because cimetidine is Tagamet and that is an H2 antihistamine for acid reflux

[Disaster]

The Mast cell activation theory clearly fits this.  The urinary tract is lined with extremely large number of  mast cells.  In pois sufferers this get activated by semen.  No semen means no mast cell degranulation.  Fits 100%

When you say a statement like that it would be helpful to back it up with a link that backs it up. I have Dysautonomia and many people with Dysautonomia have Mast Cell Activation disorders, but it is not an exact science and it is extremely hard to get tested for it. I am in many mast cell groups and I have read many articles that Dr. Afrin wrote, he is the expert on the subject. Occasionally he will answer emails but before I would bother him with this I would want to know where you learned that information..?

[Disaster]

I think most of us have seen the YouTube clip where an American architect underwent castration and also took testosterone supplements and this cured his POIS

why did this work?

What is interesting is I have a member in my Facebook group who claims to have had the castration and took testosterone after and he still have POIS. I think that Animus got lucky in a way because his sub type of POIS responded well to that but I think most of us won?t because I don?t think any one subtype is more than 33% of us. 

[Disaster]

Thank you again for your questions, and raising the level of this discussion, Quantum!
I have a lot of medical records, detailed health timelines, documentation of every procedure I went through... step by step.  and I'll be happy to share that on the forum-- probably not all at once! because it's a lot, but over time... I'm happy to answer all the questions- no matter how the discussion turns out, or what the conclusions are.

Since this thread is primarily about Castration, why it worked...
I think the first point, which you kindly made, is the consensus that I did have POIS, a severe case of it. And that I no longer have POIS currently.  Thank you for that. I suffered strongly from POIS through my 30s until I got the last surgery, and recovered.  Hopefully our discussion will also be disseminated and parsed out more scientifically by interested health professionals/ researchers. I'm an architect. Perhaps they can shed more light on what actually worked in my case. 

I went from suffering from severe POIS for up to 7 days post- orgasm/ ejaculation...
to currently being able to have orgasm 2 or 3 times per week, with no symptoms, no missed days at work.   I have a small business, have my own apartment, and am happily employed in my work.
However, can't have kids now. I can still enjoy sex though and have a fulfilling relationship.

You asked which of the surgeries was responsible for eliminating the POIS.
All of them were responsible.  I started small... saw improvements, and proceeded with caution over 3-4 years. I went with the theory that ---Semen Production--  is what causes POIS in our case.   Orgasm/ ejaculation triggers Semen Production, regeneration.  There is a Refactory period of up to 7 days after ejaculation... which essentially matches perfectly the period that I suffered from POIS.

My theory is basically that semen regeneration is responsible for all the symptoms... and the way to avoid semen regeneration is either to not have ejaculation, or eliminate the organs that produce semen, thereby making it impossible to produce it.  (There could be other ways) That also leads to "dry ejaculation".  I instinctively felt that my body was "Robbing Peter to Pay Paul" in effect while I was regenerating semen.

TESTICLE #1:
I had developed abnormally large and painful testicles... so my First surgery was to remove 1 testicle.
I had a huge improvement in symptoms and health immediately.
However, within about 3 months, the remaining testicle grew almost double it's size to compensate for the missing one. And I was back to square one.


TESTICLE #2:
Second surgery was to remove the second testicle. Much more complicated.
I have to say- that was a very hard thing to do, personally, emotionally- so I really understand that.  I didn't want to change my sex, become more feminine, or have any desire to harm myself.   However, I figured I was worse off with POIS, than I was without my testicles... so I decided to go for it.

The second surgery helped reduce my POIS again by about 30% or close to that. However, it also caused some problems, which took time to properly treat. 

TESTOSTERONE REPLACEMENT:
The problem was that I didn't produce Testosterone any more. So I needed to see a very good Endocrinologist, who could properly administer the right amount of Testosterone. Initially, I was given too much, 1ml per week, and became very jittery.. and a lot of other things.  But after about a year, we found the right dose to be exactly .35mls per week- much lower.  I have been on that dose now for almost a decade. I regularly give myself a shot of testosterone every week.  Testosterone is a critical male hormone, as we all know, and without it, one can become depressed, weak, frail, lose muscle and other things...etc. Also you can't have an erection without it... which could possibly be worse than having POIS... depending.

After the Second surgery, and finding the right dose of Testosterone... I was finally able to start working again, and get my own apartment again. My POIS had been reduced significantly but still present. I still had POIS, but not quite as catastrophically. My condition still prevented me from having a relationship, and required me to schedule my Orgasm/ ejaculation on days when I knew I could take 2 days to recover.  But it went down from 6-7 days to 2 days I'd say.

I stayed that way for a few years.  Then I think it was in 2009, that I had the 3rd and 4th surgeries. I had to go to India for those. It was over $6,000 I think. none of it covered by insurance.


PROSTATE:
The 3rd and 4th surgeries were done a few days apart.  First the Urologist did a TURP. I originally wanted to entirely remove my Prostate, but I researched it, and found it was risky, could lead to incontinence, lack of erection.  So I opted for a TURP-- which is fairly non invasive, removal of a lot of the Prostate Tissue. But keeping it. The Prostate is one of the sex organs, and produces a component of Semen.


SEMINAL VESICLES:
The other organs that make semen are the Seminal Vesicles, and the Cowper's gland.  The Seminal Vesicles contribute probably the bulk of the Semen fluid. I had those removed. That is an unusual and invasive surgery because they are hidden behind the prostate. The Cowper's gland does not contribute much volume, and my Urologist recommended keeping it in, so I did.


POST OPERATIVE RECOVERY:
So the danger of these operations is that it's possible to become incontinent, and or lose ability to have an erection.  I did not have either of those things.  I had a solid recovery... it took some time though, and definitely a few weeks before I was on my feet again. After recovering, I was able to have an erection again, and have an orgasm, however now it was Dry Ejaculation. No Semen came out. The feeling was pretty much exactly the same orgasm though.


SUPPLEMENTS/ MEDICINE:
I currently take medicine to control the size of my Prostate, to keep it from enlarging again. I find this is really important to follow up with.  I take FLOMAX- a prescription from my local urologist. And I take SUPER BETA PROSTATE- which is and herbal supplement, quite powerful, actually effective also to reduce the Prostate.

whew! it's a lot.
I might take a little break from all this now. hope that helps. Thanks,
Animus

Amazing to finally see those details! Thanks. Only took you a decade to post about it lol but seriously better late than never! I sent you a private message too.

It?s really interesting you have enlarged testicles to begin with. Mine have never been enlarged, but I have always had terrible soreness in them and painful varicosels. Also there have been times after orgasm where it felt like there was a 20 lbs weight wrapped around them pulling them down and to stand on my feet would cause pain in my testicles like a hernia almost. Long before your video came out I dreamed about just snipping them off because of that. Eventually that soreness spread to my lower abdominals, both inner thighs and my lower back.  I can relate to the Lower back pain. When I was a teenager I was a professional level athlete in multiple sports. One day I orgasmed and played tennis right after and I threw my back out completely. It felt liek I would be paralyzed in a fetus position, I could not straighten my back at all. After that my running days were over.

I think you should not count out the autoimmune theory in your cure. You mistakenly confuse Waldinger?s original Allergy Theory with his later Autoimmune theory. The Autoimmune theory is more like Celiac Disease. Semen in this case is like Gluten for Celiac. Since your semen stopped it?s like you removed the ?gluten?. Waldinger was unsure if it was the actual semen or a hormone or something else related. Perhaps it?s a chemical in the production of semen. That?s what I think should be researched

[demografx]

This whole "subtype" thing to me is irrelevant.
it's unproven. and I think it's sort of a product of endless online noodling...
honestly, I am yet to be convinced of any "subtypes".
However, I'm not going to dispute them on the forum.

plus--- it's more than simply castration.
As I took many pains to explain on the forum...
there are 3 organs which produce semen.
the testicles are only responsible for a small fraction of the volumen of semen.
the prostate, and seminal vesicles are also very significant.
I myself, did not cure my POIS solely through castration.
period.
please share.
thanks.

[Disaster]

I think Quantum summed up my background very well.  Very accurately and scientifically.

I apologize, but won't be able to take part on this thread on a daily basis, as my business is very busy right now.

But briefly, Yes,
The surgeries removed both Testicles. Removed the Seminal Vesicles. Surgically reduced the Prostate, but left it in.  Cowper's gland was also left in on recommendation of my Doctor. Because the amount of semen the Cowper's produces is very fractional, small.. and he felt it would be also good just to have some lubrication of the urethra. 

I started on a weekly dose of Testosterone replacement.  Because of many things, but mainly because one can get depressed, lose muscle mass, etc. when you are low T... And I also still wanted to have sex every now and then.

Other than that- I take Avodart to further reduce my Prostate.
I think I did a "pie-chart" once for the group, showing the different components of Semen
(which includes Sperm from the Testicles, and  other ejaculatory fluids from the Seminal Vesicles, Prostate, Cowper's...
Now, this is a Pie chart that I made through my own research at the time... so please don't cite it as any official chart.!

I found this ? The ejaculate is composed of secretions from various sources. Two-thirds of the ejaculate volume is contributed by the seminal vesicles, one-third is contributed by the prostate, up to 10% is derived from the testicle and epididymis, and a small component is derived from the bulbo-urethral glands.2?