Author Topic: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm  (Read 390 times)

LookingForACure

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POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« on: January 07, 2019, 12:44:35 AM »
Hello Poisers. I made an account here earlier today and figured that before I ask my question, I'd give an introduction with my POIS history/symptoms since this seems like a tight community. If you're not interested in my intro, feel free to skip down the part labelled "the question". I also apologize if any of this is unclear or if my writing is awkward because I am in the full throes of POIS right now.

Anyway, I'm currently 20, in college for computer science and from northeastern US. I'm not entirely sure when my POIS symptoms began, but I began masturbating at a fairly normal age, sometime around early or mid 8th grade, and I believe I may have had POIS symptoms then. I am sure that I had them in my freshman year of high school. The first symptoms I had (and noticed) were primarily social. After transferring to a new district for high school, I made almost no friends my freshman year. I felt socially slow, very awkard. I actually self-diagnosed myself with autism at one point. This diagnosis was very far from the truth, but I couldn't think of any way to explain my complete inability to make friends/talk to people. It wasn't anxiety, it wasn't that I couldn't read people faces or didn't understand social norms. I just couldn't think of things to say, and I felt like I could never keep up in social situations. This continued into sophomore year until january when I started taking adderall. I took this drug for six months and it made a huge difference in my social symptoms. Overnight I became quick-witted, funny, and sociable. It was literally unbelievable, but it was a godsend for me. Unfortunately, the effects began to lessen, and I quit at the end of the school year. Over the next year, I began to run and this generally "sped me up" a bit socially for a few days afterwards. It wasn't like adderall, but it made me feel at least a little bit more clearheaded. I believe this is also around the time I began to realize that my symptoms were related to orgasm, and I have memories of intentionally going days without masturbation to improve my social skills. My first month of college was the first time I went a full month without masturbating, and I experienced excellent effects. I was funny like I was in my childhood and social situations no longer scared me, I didn't even think about them. After a few relapses, I tried my second treatment (after adderall), zinc. Zinc worked decently for me, I felt like it sped up my recovery a bit, and it made me feel a bit more energetic. But the changes weren't huge. It was around freshman year of college that I started realizing the severity of the cognitive effects that orgasms would have on me (though I'd been aware of focus/concentration issues since high school). I became dumber, school became more stressful, brain fog set in, and life became more difficult overall. I remember learning things twice as fast for my finals during my 60 day streak at the end of my freshman year of college than I had before. Mathematical concepts in particular came a lot easier to me. This effect on general cognitive ability has been quite noticeable. I found a girlfriend my sopohmore year that made long streaks a bit harder, and also confirmed that my problem had to do with orgasm and not just masturbation. Now I'm a junior, and have been struggling a ton with harder classes and figuring out my future, so I'm trying to double down and figure out my POIS. Here is the info on my illness currently:

Physical symptoms: Hives during sex/masturbation (unsure if this is POIS or normal), possible exacerbation of digestive issues (though I'm not sure about this one), slight fatigue. I used to have a weird symptom that could best be described as "never feeling quite comfortable". It would manifest in a few ways, but the main way I remember was that I could never lie down in a comfortable position. I would keep tossing and turning and always felt a deep-seated sense of discomfort. I don't have this anymore, but I thought it was an interesting and specific symptom to include.

Cognitive symptoms: Compromised problem-solving ability, MUCH slower learning, trouble "grasping" concepts, poor social skills (though these days this symptom is much improved), poor motivation though this symptom is always there to an extent, reduced energy, reduced video game skill/worse reflexes.

Unlike many of you, my POIS symptoms are subtle enough that nothing immediately jumps out as being totally wrong. But over time, they have really prevented me from getting where I want to be in life, and only when I go a long time without O do I realize all of life that I'm missing. It's amazing to feel like I'm funny, smart, social, to feel energetic etc. and POIS steals those feelings from me. I'm glad I finally found out that POIS was a thing, because before that I felt like a misfit on NoFap. Definitely having symptoms with porn and masturbation, but also having symptoms with sex.

Effective treatments:
Adderall: Havent done it much in the past few years, but it turns me on socially. Even now that my social skills aren't painfully terrible after O like they used to be, they definitely aren't great and prevent me from having much of a socia life. Adderall makes me much better in social situations. I believe it also increases focus/intelligence, and a couple times when I've taken it in college I've done problem sets in half the normal amount of time. I also remember taking a spanish final in 12 minutes or something on adderall in high school, when I would usually hardly be able to finish in the 52 min class. Symptom reduction 100% social, maybe 50% cognitive? I believe the benefits of Adderall are 50-50 general to POIS Specific

Magnesium (doctors best mag glycinate): This helped a lot with some cognitive symptoms, for a while the summer after freshman year I was taking magnesium and Oing every day, and I was still sort of able to function. Unfortunately, it started to give me horrible migraines, so I've had to quit. Maybe 30-50% cognitive symptom reduction when I'm not laying in bed waiting for tylenol to kick in? I think benefits of magnesium are partially general, but predominantly POIS specific.

Zinc: Hard to put in percentage. Mostly felt like slightly faster recovery socially and mentally. I think the benefits of zinc are predominantly POIS specific. The only general change seems to be that it makes me hornier.

Exercise (specifically running): Maybe 20-30% social symptoms reduction. 20% cognitive. This used to work better for me, sometimes now I feel like it even hurts a bit. Excessive exercise (hour+ cardio or too much intensity) can be extremely deleterious. Gives me horrible anxiety and complete inability to think for days, so I avoid this at all costs. I think benefits of exercise are probably general and not POIS specific.

Cigarettes: I find that smoking, even hours after a cigarette, improves some of my symptoms markedly. It makes me feel much more comfortable and bold socially, I'd say like 70 or 80% symptom reduction. I feel more self confident and in the moment. Somewhat more focused in general. Cognitive issues not really ameliorated with the exception of focus, maybe 10%?? I believe the positive effects of cigarettes are predominantly POIS specific.

Tylenol but NOT ibuprofen: Improved mood and feel somewhat clearer-headed. Don't know if POIS-related, but an observation that I thought I'd share.

Niacin: Have just ordered, excited to try it out!

POIS duration: As far as I know, it starts at orgasm (maybe before; my question will be about this). Bad for next day, gets slightly better next day, slightly better day after that etc.. After five or six days I have substantially improved energy and I feel close to normal. After eight to ten I start feeling solid. Symptoms improve in general for as long as I've ever gone (though sometimes I will get weird short-lived dips akin to nofap "flatline"). For me, eight to ten days feels sort of normal, while after that I start to feel a bit like a superhero. But I guess POIS has probably distorted what normal really is, so me feeling like a superhero is probably just normal to many others.

The question: Sometimes when I go on long streaks without orgasming, I start to fantasize a lot. Sometimes I'll spend 30 or 45 minutes at a time, typically before I go to sleep. I've always known that this was a bad habit; it inevitably leads to me jacking off a couple days later because it strengthens my urges. However, I've also noticed recently that, in addition to building sexual tension and making me feel kinda crappy, it seems to cause many of my POIS symptoms. I think that some of the flatline symptoms I've experienced during my streaks in the past may have to do with this. The symptoms I have are bad enough that sometimes jacking off seems to be a good idea, because it at least chills me out and gets rid of the urges, allowing me to start on a new streak. Have any of you had this problem? Also, can someone a bit more familiar with the science behind POIS tell me whether this is something that makes sense or not? The name POIS seems to suggest the effects come from the orgasm, but maybe they are the effects of something else highly correlated with the orgasm?

Additionally, has anyone ever tested their cognitive abilities in and out of POIS? For example, forward reverse/digit span, IQ tests, Cambridge Brain Sciences, etc..

Sorry for the lengthy post! Appreciate any answers you guys might have!

demografx

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2019, 01:30:28 AM »
LookingForACure, welcome to POISCenter!

Thank you for sharing your story in-depth.
10 years of major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

Nas

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2019, 10:54:36 AM »
Welcome to this forum LookingForACure
As you mentioned this is such a debilitating illness unfortunately and it occurs after sex and heals up when abstaining. It seems that unfortunately, at least in my case, there is no solution yet to POIS. There are treatment methods proposed around here but they are highly individualized and they also require more abstaining. I have never tried Aderall and I'm interested to try it.
I'd personally advise to see a doctor for Mast Cell Activation Syndrome diagnosis, as POIS is very similar to MCAS with POIS being perhaps more localized in the Central Nervous System.

demografx

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2019, 08:34:58 PM »
I liked Adderall too much. I think it’s addictive.
10 years of major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

Quantum

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2019, 08:47:57 PM »
Hi LFAC, and welcome to the forum!

Thanks for your detailed introduction. 

You are not the first member to report symptoms of POIS unrelated to orgasm.  Some members have reported that same as you, that is, symptoms after getting excited ( like when you fantasize), even just by looking to an attractive women in the street ( lesser symptoms than after a release, though).   So, there are some hypothesis out there, like the pre-cum from Cooper glands that may be the culprit, for example. But so many things are mot known about POIS, and there seems to be more than just one type of POIS.

Nicotine is a good cognitive booster, because it is cholinergic.  Many members have benefic effect from cholinergic agents.

For more info on this and other way members have found for relief, I suggest you take a look at the POIS Types Chart I have done:  http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2338.msg19448#msg19448

You are 100% responsible for what you do with anything I post on this forum and of any consequence it could have for you.  Forum rule: ""Do not use POISCenter as a substitute for, or to give, medical advice" Read the remaining part at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=1.msg10259#msg10259

demografx

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2019, 01:17:10 AM »
Can anyone recommend a good, simple beginning introduction to MCAS?

Either a link to a post here or any outside reference.

Thank you.


« Last Edit: January 08, 2019, 01:18:50 AM by demografx »
10 years of major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

Observer

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2019, 07:12:22 AM »
This is a personal opinion of course, but I believe that having POIS symptoms in other situations that don't involve orgasm might be related to an over-active vagus nerve that it gets triggered in certain situations. The only way to know it for sure is by funding a medical research!

LookingForACure

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2019, 03:59:02 PM »
LookingForACure, welcome to POISCenter!

Thank you for sharing your story in-depth.

I liked Adderall too much. I think it’s addictive.

Thank you for the welcome! I'm a bit star struck right now... have probably read at least 100 of your posts. The major downsides of adderall are tolerance and addiction. I think it's likely that adderall functions as a band-aid solution. For me it only works to cure POIS while it is in effect, so I don't think it actually has anything to do with the mechanism of POIS.

Welcome to this forum LookingForACure
As you mentioned this is such a debilitating illness unfortunately and it occurs after sex and heals up when abstaining. It seems that unfortunately, at least in my case, there is no solution yet to POIS. There are treatment methods proposed around here but they are highly individualized and they also require more abstaining. I have never tried Aderall and I'm interested to try it.
I'd personally advise to see a doctor for Mast Cell Activation Syndrome diagnosis, as POIS is very similar to MCAS with POIS being perhaps more localized in the Central Nervous System.

This is a personal opinion of course, but I believe that having POIS symptoms in other situations that don't involve orgasm might be related to an over-active vagus nerve that it gets triggered in certain situations. The only way to know it for sure is by funding a medical research!

Interesting, I'll look into both of these things.

Hi LFAC, and welcome to the forum!

Thanks for your detailed introduction. 

You are not the first member to report symptoms of POIS unrelated to orgasm.  Some members have reported that same as you, that is, symptoms after getting excited ( like when you fantasize), even just by looking to an attractive women in the street ( lesser symptoms than after a release, though).   So, there are some hypothesis out there, like the pre-cum from Cooper glands that may be the culprit, for example. But so many things are mot known about POIS, and there seems to be more than just one type of POIS.

Nicotine is a good cognitive booster, because it is cholinergic.  Many members have benefic effect from cholinergic agents.

For more info on this and other way members have found for relief, I suggest you take a look at the POIS Types Chart I have done:  http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2338.msg19448#msg19448



I have seen this list... it is excellent! I think it's great to put everything into one place, makes the forum much less intimidating for newcomers like me, and separates the wheat from the chaff in terms of information quality. I tried niacin last night and screwed it up a bit. I ended up taking 500 mg total because I didn't think the first 250 mg was going to cause a flush, and ejaculated as the flush was kicking in. The flush got pretty crazy. Today, my symptoms seem somewhat reduced, maybe 30 or 40%. I'm excited to not mess niacin up the next time I try. Cholinergic supplements seem promising to me, because of the benefits I get from nicotine that seem to extend beyond the normal benefits people get. My friends have always been surprised that I can feel mentally (and also in the lungs ;D) that I have smoked for hours after doing so. Most people I know get a one or two minute headrush, and then nothing. I'm going to pick up some alpha GPC, just a bit worried about the connection between excessive acetylcholine and depression.


In case anyone is interested, I have some pois symptoms after hot showers and I've seen that this is a pattern among POISers. I'm guessing histamine related, because my skin get's irritated as well. The symptoms are reasonably noticeable, and they sort of give me the pois "feel", but it seems that the symptoms reverse fairly quickly. I also seem to have similar symptoms from soy; I'm thinking that this could be an allergy, and that means another histamine connection.

Does anyone understand the pathology behind niacin-treatable POIS? I have seen people say that it has something to do with the mast cells/histamine, but haven't seen a complete explanation.

Limejuice

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2019, 04:14:56 PM »
For me the benefits of symptom reduction from niacin came from the flush... the non-flush variants of niacin did nothing.

demografx

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2019, 05:21:07 PM »
In case anyone is interested, I have some pois symptoms after hot showers and I've seen that this is a pattern among POISers. I'm guessing histamine related, because my skin get's irritated as well.

I looooove hot showers, but I have *horrible* reactions.

What a cruel trick of nature.

I even react badly when the shower is lukewarm.

Now, when I jump in the shower, I try to soap & rinse...as rapidly as possible!


« Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 05:58:56 PM by demografx »
10 years of major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

Vandemolen

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2019, 06:35:35 PM »
Before I was in a POIS state for 3 months hot showers used to help me with POIS. In the period before two years ago I was lazy and went to bed after sex. Just cleaned that area with wet toilet paper. The next morning I shower. But since I get my shower (gather all the stuff I need) ready before sex I always take a hot shower directly after sex. And then I went to bed. That brought my symptoms down. That was before I became ill 3 months ago. Since then hot showers make me sick. In 3 months I did not have sex. After 1 month I figured out that it was better to shower with lukewarm water. And after 2 months I use natrium carbonate for my skin when I shower. That also helps a bit. I think the hot water makes my urticaria worse. After a hot shower I have a vague feeling in my neck. When someone passes me it is like I feel a hard wind in my neck. Strangely I get that feeling too when I go outside when it is cold outside. And I used to get it when in POIS.

I was wondering, people who say hot showers makes them feel bad. Is that only when in POIS or also outside of POIS?
« Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 06:40:12 PM by Vandemolen »
POIS since 2000. Very bad since 2008. I knew that I have POIS since June 2010. Desensitization since March 2011. I stopped with desens in July 2016. I have 50% less POIS. And only 1 day of POIS. Purified CBD works for me, but I am allergic for CBD.

demografx

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2019, 06:57:23 PM »

I was wondering, people who say hot showers makes them feel bad. Is that only when in POIS or also outside of POIS?


Both.
10 years of major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

Vandemolen

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2019, 07:56:00 PM »

I was wondering, people who say hot showers makes them feel bad. Is that only when in POIS or also outside of POIS?


Both.
When you get sick by a hot shower out of POIS what do you think is the reason? In my case I think it is a form of urticaria. I had this before, but only short periods of one or max two weeks.
POIS since 2000. Very bad since 2008. I knew that I have POIS since June 2010. Desensitization since March 2011. I stopped with desens in July 2016. I have 50% less POIS. And only 1 day of POIS. Purified CBD works for me, but I am allergic for CBD.

demografx

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Re: POIS symptoms from sexual behavior without orgasm
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2019, 09:24:45 PM »
I have no idea.
10 years of major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.