Poll

Have you been screened for a varicocele?

Yes and found a varicocele on the right side.
1 (3%)
Yes and found a varicocele on the left side.
15 (45.5%)
Yes and found varicoceles on both sides.
4 (12.1%)
Yes but a varicocele has not been found.
0 (0%)
No
13 (39.4%)

Total Members Voted: 33

Author Topic: Varicocele  (Read 16802 times)

Muon

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2023, 09:42:29 AM »
The reason why i am saying it several times is because i have congenital bicuspid aortic valve. Everyone in my familly seems to have some problems with vessels(especially dad which got hypertensive crisis in brains recently). I also have left testicle varicocele and i already did have an operation two years ago but it didnt seem to help.

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2023, 02:59:14 PM »
Yes. I have been to urologyst today. He didnt really say anything about varicocele. He simply said its just has to be done(operation).
I ve mentioned my problem(POIS). I ve said that i have cold hands, cold feet, muscle fatigue, heart problems, brain fog. And he said to go to neurologyst or andrologyst. And that he will not do operation because he is a child urologyst and i am not a child anymore(18+ policy).

I feel like he didnt even want to listen. He wasnt interested in it. I was hopefull. Now i am less hopefull. I mean i had hopes that he would at least check for this syndrome. But i feel like he almost immidiately "rejected" me, although he tried best to be calm and patient with me.

But there are some benefits of this visit. I feel like my mom starts to understand me. And also i didnt know about even existence of "andrologyst". I only knew about urologyst.
I will have general doctor apppointment and will be asking about andrologyst appointment or some piece of information about this type of doctor. I feel like andrologyst can help or at least understand me.

I have no real changes in symtpoms. In terms of POIS and stress triggered POIS. I mean same symtpoms, same methods. Maybe MACA helps. I will continue taking it. Glycin helps a little bit with anxiety but not too much. I didnt try captopril. Maybe i wont, idk. I wanted to try it just because i have heart "bad feature" and also i feel like POIS mechanism involves vessels spasms with which captopril might help.

That`s my portion of information for today and a very tiny little impact on POIS researching.(I guess any information might be usefull)

Anyways guys, ask anything, any theories, hypothesis, questions. Also any piece of advice will be much appreciated(even if i try it and it doesnt work).

But most importantly: good luck to you all! Because its the most important thing in our lives in this real sometimes cruel and ridiculously stupid world.
 

Progecitor

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #22 on: March 30, 2023, 01:52:57 AM »
There are indications that Stoneroot (Collinsonia canadensis) could be useful in the treatment for varicose veins in legs, hemorrhoids and varicocele. Even if it doesn’t treat POIS, it could be a good remedy for these complaints. I only tried it for one day and it was not useful as an acute POIS treatment, but it may be beneficial in a longer-term.

It is certainly a good remedy in vesical catarrh. Good results have come from its employment in spermatorrhoea and varicocele, when accompanied by piles. Catarrhal conditions, whether of renal, vesical, or genito-urinary organs, or of the respiratory mucous surfaces, are speedily, benefited by it. Even the cough of phthisis is rendered much less harassing by its administration.
https://www.henriettes-herb.com/eclectic/kings/collinsonia.html
The cause is probably the senescence of sexual organs and resultant inducible SASP, which also acts as a kind of non-diabetic metabolic syndrome.

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2023, 11:52:06 AM »
Idk maybe will try maybe not. I will definitely start trying more things after a visit to an andrologyst.
But i also don`t fully understand one thing: POIS is definitely connected to gut(i guess small intestines or big intestine, lower part of belly, to be specific) because the more i eat the worse POIS i get. Also now after a meal i have ~10% POIS-like symptoms. And the more i fast the less the POIS is. But i also have to eat because otherwise i will not have energy for my body to regenerate/repair itself.
So my question is: is POIS caused by some problems with intestines or with gut? Or like Progecitor`s theory explains - by some major disorder in some cellular metabolism of cells which are present in many places in body including intestines? It also worsens everytime. Not even after ejaculation. Even after an arousal.
I also tried and i am trying MACA NOW foods 500mg with 500mg or 1000mg dose. But i haven`t noticed any effects.
Progecitor also please say something about the thing that the best method of relieving the symptoms(after arousal and after o but i just dont dare to do o now) is hard, long physical activity which makes my body very warm. Maybe that`s because (considering your theory) more blood comes to sexual organs? And blood is essential, obviously.(Also considering i have varicocele)

Also, where can i find any NORD researches, results? I`ve checked in the internet but didnt find.
 

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #24 on: March 30, 2023, 12:27:54 PM »
Checked video in your last post on that link, Progecitor. Dr. Prause already have a theory(which is insipiring) about POIS? And if yes i can ask her for free research data?

Progecitor

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #25 on: March 30, 2023, 03:18:53 PM »
Idk maybe will try maybe not. I will definitely start trying more things after a visit to an andrologyst.
But i also don`t fully understand one thing: POIS is definitely connected to gut(i guess small intestines or big intestine, lower part of belly, to be specific) because the more i eat the worse POIS i get. Also now after a meal i have ~10% POIS-like symptoms. And the more i fast the less the POIS is. But i also have to eat because otherwise i will not have energy for my body to regenerate/repair itself.
So my question is: is POIS caused by some problems with intestines or with gut? Or like Progecitor`s theory explains - by some major disorder in some cellular metabolism of cells which are present in many places in body including intestines? It also worsens everytime. Not even after ejaculation. Even after an arousal.
I also tried and i am trying MACA NOW foods 500mg with 500mg or 1000mg dose. But i haven`t noticed any effects.
Progecitor also please say something about the thing that the best method of relieving the symptoms(after arousal and after o but i just dont dare to do o now) is hard, long physical activity which makes my body very warm. Maybe that`s because (considering your theory) more blood comes to sexual organs? And blood is essential, obviously.(Also considering i have varicocele)

Also, where can i find any NORD researches, results? I`ve checked in the internet but didnt find.

More specifically I believe that POIS originates from one specific point in the body, but propagates as a fluctuating wave-like motion throughout the body constantly destabilizing the labile homeostatic balance. One may put it as a cytokine storm, however that also carries the false connotation that it simply comes and passes. The storm in my case never ceases, but over the course of time changes its amplitude and intensity. The storm strikes hard when I do sexual activity, physical activity or eat some POIS-mimetics. However even in the CFS phase it keeps rumbling and strangling me ever so gently.

I also had the same experience in the past with fasting. Many times I would feel myself so well mentally, only to eat something and become depressed again. Even so being hungry would often make me act more aggressively. I can also sleep more soundly and get up much better, when I don’t eat several hours before bed, but then again I would often not be able to get myself to sleep due to the pangs of hunger. When I have more severe POIS episodes I also tend to lose weight. When I was working a lot I progressively lost weight and I was afraid that I would waste away, even though I kept eating as much as I was able to. I think fasting is only a temporary solution and also a double-edged sword, so nowadays I don’t really force myself to do it. I think it is better to just eat smaller portions to ease your digestion, although as I remember I read some scientific news recently that actually claimed otherwise, but I can’t recall the specifics right now.

I am glad you tried maca and reported about it, even if it doesn’t work. I can’t really say why it is so. I have to note that so far I have tested at least six maca products and out of them only 2 worked really well. I had the most success with a 6:1 extract capsule and yet a 20:1 extract was less beneficial from an other brand, thus product quality is really variable. The other one that was more beneficial was the yellow powdered version. Even so the black maca capsules and the red maca powder was much less beneficial and a tricolor version actually provided mixed reactions as I would often develop quite bad bloodshot eyes shortly after consumption. I haven’t tried the NowFood one, but I will order some just to make a reference. I think the normal 500 mg one is not an extract and thus its efficacy may be too low to provide a noticeable benefit. I also have to emphasize that maca had never solved my problems completely even in a greater amount. I only said that it provides a more noticeable benefit. Maybe you could try the maca+lion’s mane+ginger+cetirizine combination I mentioned earlier. Even that one did not completely resolve my problems acutely, but had an even more pronounced benefit. As I remember with that combination I also felt the kind of warmness you mentioned earlier. Of course ginger acts as a vasodilator to increase blood flow through increasing NO, but then again your varicocele issues could be prohibiting. I think I had a similar experience with muira puama as well, but that one gave me rather bad heart issues even if POIS was quite well reduced. In this regard I had wanted to test a combination of ginger, paullinia cupana (aka Guarana), muira puama and L-citrulline, which should have a similar effect on NO as Sildenafil (aka Viagra). Actually I found all of these to be somewhat beneficial individually, although to a variable degree. Of course one would need to be very careful with dosages as this combination could be a very potent one.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4578663/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1089860317302872
 
Actually given that you had more success with garlic I think you should rather try fenugreek instead of maca as many people had good outcomes from such a combination. For some reason I did not, but as we know POIS is not uniform either and members usually don’t provide correlative data even if they find something good, so it is impossible to say what would be beneficial for one or another member.

I don’t know if you have checked my supplement experiments, but you can find them here:
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=3798.msg40769#msg40769

Please keep in mind that I have only tested most of them for only a few days, so they may be not reliable. Also especially some of the better ones also often had considerable side-effects as well, so you should be careful when testing them. Some of the ones I could recommend are Saffron, Resveratrol,  Damiana, Catuaba bark, Lycopene + vit. E, Astaxanthin + vit. E, Chios Mastiha (mastic gum), Guggul, L-Theanine, Milk thistle, Diosmin + Hesperidin, medicinal mushrooms (mostly Lion’s mane, Ganoderma/Reishi, Turkey tail), Cat’s claw, Andrographis. Most of these were beneficial for other members as well. If nothing else Diosmin + Hesperidin should be a great one as it has been proven to improve varicose disorders.

Anyway another way to become more warm would be to increase thermogenesis. It is achieved by increasing browning of adipose tissue. Kids have more brown fat contrary to older people who have white fat dominance. This is supposedly the reason why children are less susceptible to feeling cold. Some ways to improve browning of adipose tissue could be by using PGC-1a, Nrf2, AMPK, SIRT1 and ERbeta agonists. Coincidentally this aligns with the model of metabolic syndrome. Of course both fasting and exercise induces PGC-1a, so its involvement is rather undeniable. What I am trying to figure out is the fine detail like why exercise intolerance happens nevertheless.
The cause is probably the senescence of sexual organs and resultant inducible SASP, which also acts as a kind of non-diabetic metabolic syndrome.

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #26 on: March 30, 2023, 06:43:02 PM »
Thank you for your information and your response. Today feeling slightly better. Maybe i will try increasing MACA dosages. I doubt it can cause any damage.
Also i see many POISers have such a symptom as exercise intolerance. Can you elaborate more on what that is? Is it just muscle fatigue? Because i kinda feel weak when trying to lift dumbbells at first(when i have cold feet, cold hands, almost what i call muscle refusal) but i know that in 100% cases it helps if i push myself through this state, become warmer and eventually warm myself enough to feel energy.
Also, this is w little bit strange but when i start lift i feel like its impossible to lift even one time. I feel like i just don't have energy. But after every time my muscles become more and more energized or what, idk how to explain.
And did you try this method? Hard, physical exercise. I usually help myself with a lot of hot, really hot tea. As i always said my body temperature is always 100% connected with the severity of POIS symptoms.
And last question: do you have a recommendations, any piece of advice on anything which will help with mental symptoms? Especially with anxiety. But also with saving mental clarity. Not like benzos. They just pretty much put me into a 1-5% consciousness mode. Almost like a sleep.
Alcohol also seems to kinda help(even overall on some POIS symptoms. ) But it's a sedative. Same type of dealing with POIS.

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #27 on: March 31, 2023, 04:53:19 PM »
Also, progecitor, do you have something that gives you a persistant, consistant and significant result(significant relief, 80-90 or even 100% symptom relief)? I`ve read your posts. I`ve seen your Summary and your list of what helps. Does all of that back your theory up? And is this your theory or is it NORD theory? Where can i check current NORD experiments data?
And have you tried anti-depressants or benzos? Or weed?
Sorry for a stupid questions.

Progecitor

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2023, 07:09:56 AM »
Thank you for your information and your response. Today feeling slightly better. Maybe i will try increasing MACA dosages. I doubt it can cause any damage.
Also i see many POISers have such a symptom as exercise intolerance. Can you elaborate more on what that is? Is it just muscle fatigue? Because i kinda feel weak when trying to lift dumbbells at first(when i have cold feet, cold hands, almost what i call muscle refusal) but i know that in 100% cases it helps if i push myself through this state, become warmer and eventually warm myself enough to feel energy.
Also, this is w little bit strange but when i start lift i feel like its impossible to lift even one time. I feel like i just don't have energy. But after every time my muscles become more and more energized or what, idk how to explain.
And did you try this method? Hard, physical exercise. I usually help myself with a lot of hot, really hot tea. As i always said my body temperature is always 100% connected with the severity of POIS symptoms.
And last question: do you have a recommendations, any piece of advice on anything which will help with mental symptoms? Especially with anxiety. But also with saving mental clarity. Not like benzos. They just pretty much put me into a 1-5% consciousness mode. Almost like a sleep.
Alcohol also seems to kinda help(even overall on some POIS symptoms. ) But it's a sedative. Same type of dealing with POIS.

Also, progecitor, do you have something that gives you a persistant, consistant and significant result(significant relief, 80-90 or even 100% symptom relief)? I`ve read your posts. I`ve seen your Summary and your list of what helps. Does all of that back your theory up? And is this your theory or is it NORD theory? Where can i check current NORD experiments data?
And have you tried anti-depressants or benzos? Or weed?
Sorry for a stupid questions.

Regarding your question about exercise intolerance. I have a kind of ever present muscle pain/fatigue, especially in my thighs that gets more noticeable when I move around, but less so when I am only sitting and at rest. I also found that a short bout of physical exercise is beneficial for my cognition and circulation, yet even so the pain would increase. When doing physical work for an extended time though the pain would increase even more so and other POIS symptoms like bloodshot eyes and gut issues would also become worse at the same time. This would also lead to a more pronounced depression later. Similarly to you I also have problems with lifting weighs. I have less trouble when holding weighs, but when I want to lift them up, while holding them, I would experience a sudden increase in pain that would make me feel really weak and uncertain if I can hold it just another second more. Of course my colleges would often joke about how weak I am. There were periods when I had to work more than right now and I was quite muscular at some points. I could certainly hold more weighs then, however I had the same pain and lifting issues as always. I think this would suggest some energetic crisis. Nevertheless I often had to do work that was more demanding on endurance. My colleges would more often complain about it than I would ever have, but the reason may be only that I was too accustomed to the pain and at certain points I just couldn’t care anymore. I used shear willpower to survive those demanding days, but at least I had never dropped dead or fainted no matter how terribly I felt.

Yes, I also noticed that drinking warm tea would often temporary help with depression, but this would only last a few minutes at most, thus only a symptomatic aid. The same is true for taking warm baths. It is quite usual for me to take a warm bath right after O. It can help energize me, especially if the weather is cold. It would also exert a temporary inhibition on POIS and would often prevent or delay the evolution of more severe symptoms like chest inflammation. Even so I found cold water showers equally beneficial, that I prefer to use when the weather is hot. Actually I think cleanliness is more important, than the temperature of the water. I was even wondering if removing the grease from my skin would actually help in alleviating at least some of the lipid burden in my body as cholesterol lowering supplements clearly help as well.

Please could you specify which benzo drug you used and in what dosage? In the past I was also thinking like benzos are benzos and what else to say. However after reading so much about them on the site, my opinion became rather differentiated on them. The only one I took in the past is clonazepam (Rivotril) that I took for about 6 years. I had an incessant panic attack at the time and it partially helped with that, however at the same time it made practically all my POIS symptoms much worse, like I had a much stronger photophobia, muscle fatigue/pain, aphasia (incapability to recall words), short-term memory disorder. I think it also induced bloodshot eyes, but I had that practically all the time and this also happened more than 10 years ago, thus I can no longer recall the specifics. Nevertheless recently I have become convinced that lorazepam could potentially help me. Clonazepam and Lorazepam only differ in one single functional ligand and yet they have entirely opposing effects on estrogen receptor beta that I consider a key element in my problems. Quantum once said he had a 90% relief with lorazepam and he only stopped taking it due to some side-effects. I am not a proponent of taking such drugs, but this could be a significant finding in understanding POIS. The best would be to try lorazepam myself to prove such a possibility, but the doctors consistently refuse to help me and I can’t get any prescription drugs for this reason. At least I had success with most other supplements that Quantum uses, like resveratrol, lycopene, beta sitosterol, etc, thus such an association is a certain possibility. Even so others also had reactions both good and bad to other benzos like Diazepam (Valium), Alprazolam (Xanax), Temazepam, Tetrazepam and there were even members who found Clonazepam to be useful. Of course the activation of the benzodiazepine receptors would also affect us in some ways, like I was feeling really sedated in those times and my panic was probably reduced as it blunted my perception of my surroundings. There were times when the phone was ringing loudly (alarm clock) for at least half an hour beside my bed before I even came around to recognize it to be so as I was so knocked out. Regardless of the sedative effect I am pretty sure that specifically clonazepam also increased the POIS inflammation in my system.
As you can see if benzos only affected the benzodiazepine receptors we could regard them as only benzos, but these drugs are nowhere near perfect and have many off target receptors as well, which could easily produce entirely different outcomes in our sensitized state.

I have already described my experiences with the other anti-depressants as well in my post and I don’t think I could add anything else besides. Unfortunately this happened a rather long time ago and I also did not take any notes in those times, so some of my experiences are based on what I found on the official medical papers. However I remember that sometimes they would record my statements in a way that sounded to me the exact opposite to what I was originally trying to convey, so those papers aren’t reliable either.
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=3798.msg40401#msg40401
(Ctrl+f: Psychological anamnesis)

I think I made it quite clear that most of the supplements I found to have an anti-depressive effect are in the best and good category. There is also nothing new here as most of these have been traditionally or anecdotally considered to have an anti-depressive effect. However you also shouldn’t expect any miracle either. I would often experience some kind of better mood at the peak of a drugs effect, but often it was short-lived. Supplements may also become less effective over time. Some of the supplements you could try in this regard could be Saffron, MACA (extract only), Resveratrol, Ecdysterone, Mexican wild yam root, Drotaverine, L-Tryptophan, Catuaba bark, Yerba mate, Lycopene + vit. E, Tongkat Ali, Lion’s mane, Tribulus terrestris, Phosphatidylserine, Milk thistle, Ginkgo Biloba, Fennel seed caps, Guggul, Lavender tea.

I have never smoked not even one cigarette in my entire life and especially not weed. When I was young I was in a good community that thought us how to avoid addictive and unhealthy behaviors. Later in life I had too many health issues due to POIS and I did not want to add to them by such practices. At least I had some success with CBD oil, but even that one had contained other ingredients as well. It also has to be mentioned that THC may behave much differently than CBD and some people may actually experience worsening symptoms. Another supplement to try in this regard is saffron that also affects the endocannabinoid system. By the way you should also share your experience with weed if you had any.

I am sorry to say this, but nothing has ever solved my problems more than 80%. My list reflects a partly objective and partly subjective feeling that I had experienced with each supplement in an acute setting. If you want quality information I suggest you check out the methods of other members, who claim to have succeeded more. I said so before, but my aim is to do a quantity research even if it is less reliable. I think this is the only way to find out any correlations and associations to other cases and to possibly figure out the underlying mechanism.

If you mean the theory about senescence then it is only my theory in the way that none had associated it with POIS before. However I think others did so with CFS, long covid and a number of other chronic diseases as well. Due to the convergent evidence I am rather enthusiastic about it and I wish to confirm it as thoroughly as possible.

I am in no way connected to NORD and you should turn to demografx with any such questions:
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=3046.msg46488#msg46488
The cause is probably the senescence of sexual organs and resultant inducible SASP, which also acts as a kind of non-diabetic metabolic syndrome.

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2023, 06:13:37 PM »
So first of all: thank for the detailed answer
Than about exercise intolerance:
Quote
Regarding your question about exercise intolerance. I have a kind of ever present muscle pain/fatigue, especially in my thighs that gets more noticeable when I move around, but less so when I am only sitting and at rest. I also found that a short bout of physical exercise is beneficial for my cognition and circulation, yet even so the pain would increase. When doing physical work for an extended time though the pain would increase even more so and other POIS symptoms like bloodshot eyes and gut issues would also become worse at the same time. This would also lead to a more pronounced depression later.
That`s completely different than i have. You say "A short bout of physical exercise is beneficial... yet even so the pain would increase" and your POIS symptoms will become worse. That`s absolutely different to what i have. My constant and persistant symptom that will be with me always when in POIS state (either triggered by arousal or o or even some sexual thoughts) is getting colder. More specifically getting cold feet. And i know i mentioned it earlier many times but this symptom is a very good
 and reliable indicator for when my POIS starts. I mean i always pay attention to a temperature of my feet. It is the most significant indicator. I may be repeating it in my posts because i feel like if you(not specifically you) don`t have such symtpom you can`t fully understand what am i talking about(sorry if that can be offensive to you. I didn`t intend to. I know how it`s like when you are not understood). I always have 3-4 pairs of warm socks. In winter i can have 5-6 very warm pairs of socks and by the way if POIS starts i will start having cold feet anyways. No matter how many pairs of socks i have. Not even if i am under 4 warm blankets. The colder the feet the more severe POIS symptoms i have. Always connected to feet. The reason why i print so much about cold feet is because the only 100%(literally. I don`t remember otherwise) way to relieve my POIS symptoms is to start hard physical work, exercises. It could be anything. But i also always or almost always have a feeling of how hard this exercise has to be. Like when cold feet starts i can go outside and start running(along with having dry eyes, dry skin, some feeling in gut and also bad body odor when i am sweating). And i can run for a very long time but often it won`t relieve my symptoms fully. Because often it won`t make my feet warm. But if i just take my barbell(bar(30 kgs)) and start lifting it in any ways it will make me warmer and my symptoms ot most of them will go away. Although it`s always hard to start when i am already in some point of POIS state. I am pretty much always in POIS, because i have sound sensivity(i hate people`s noises), i also hate so fcking much the sound of someone working with dishes(like the sound of simple colision of two dishes). I don`t know it drives my crazy. Especially if that sounds are coming from people i know. Especially my parents trigger me(as always i don`t blame them(don`t think bad of me, why would i)). I always try to be nice to them and my dad now knows about my syndrome too. He told me he didn`t have this syndrome ever.
My parents`s first claim is that this is psychosomatic. This idea kinda offends me(because if that`s true than i think it`s also true that i was stupid all the time and was just doing wrong decisions. Which i honestly was but that was because of POIS. Wrong decisions just obviously made my life worse and POIS worse) but i will go to psychologyst anyway and tell him/her about my syndrome(who knows maybe i will be first in my city to talk about this syndrome with some medical proffesional). I hope i won`t be captured and sent to a psychiatrich ward(because i am ashamed to talk about this and very afraid). And i think psychologyst might prescribe my antidepressants and i will try them. I might need them anyway because i have constant, anxiety and i can`t study normally. If i get them i will test them and i will share my experience with them.
As i was talking about my main 100% method of relief i wanted to say that today i went out of town with my parents to help them, they asked me to chop some wood(i had to because why would they help me than?) and also i am always sitting home(although trying to walk out with people but people nowadays..you know what. Almost everybody sits at home too, unfortunately. I would love to go outside to play a football like in a good old days). And although last night was awfull because i ate lately at night(it was 11 pm or what) and i ate much but my mistake was that i was not fully warmed and i ignored my POIS main indicator if cold feet and i was just playing games. And after a few hours. I think when the food got to my small intestines or maybe even large intestine i started feeling very very bad. I had very bad feeling in gut(can`t describe) i started feeling more colder and colder. I started sweating. I also started having something like hallucinations(random sounds in my head) also random thoughts images about anything random. I was very very angry. I wanted to punch anything. I wanted to start lifting but i tried and i was too weak and it would take too much time to fully warm up and also it was 3 or 4 am and i was afraid to wake my neighbors up and they would just call the police and i would eventually end up in a psychiatric ward. Somehow i eased my symptoms by simply walking a little bit just around my room and then i was just too tired and just fell asleep. I woke up feeling very bad. Especially with my eyes. And i had some feeling in my temples as always. But somehow i tried to lift a little bit, to move a little bit and started to feel a little better. I think maybe i was having intoxication caused by leaky gut which was at time not repairing itself because of stress(So maybe POIS damages my intestines ). So i was still feeling kinda bad. And then my parents woke up and started making noises, also with dishes. I started to feel worse but i still took myself`s whole free will and made myself to go and come out of town(because well i promised that i will go). We were going in a car and i was at that time angry, felt bad, was anxious. And also the weather was shitty at the morning. I thought i would die or will have another long or life term damage to my body. But the ride was short. 30 mins and i was breathing fresh green air. Also the weather started to change. It was becoming sunnier(i mean clouds were flying away, earth started to get more sun), it was becoming more warm. It was 12-15 degrees Celsius. And i started to chop that wood. I started to feel more better and better. After 1 hour i was fully warmed, i had much sweat and i felt great(not that great if i didnt have POIS but still it was very good). It was my first time chopping wood but it doesn`t require much time and effort to learn. And as i said earlier i was lifting before. Unfortunately because of friction/rubbing an axe with my hand i`ve got a callus on my hand and i had to stop chopping. I was a little upset. I hope it will regenerate fast and i could chop more wood.
I just wanted to say that because i feel like this story mentioned before and many more my stories, with considering what supplemets i tried, make up/ back up my hypothesis about some problems with blood flow. Maybe to properly supply my testicles with blood(because of varicocele, stressfull life, some undiagnosed problems with vessels, problem with heart). I don`t know what`s up with my gut. POIS definitely makes it worse. Maybe it makes it to be more "leaker", to leak more toxins, idk. Any problems with vessels/ can lead to very unexpected conditions. Also i had much mold in my room. Watched porn very much and i obviously masturbated too much. I abused it. I when it almost didn`t cause any noticable sympotms, any problems(as i thought at that time). And also this theory might back up yours. About senesence.
Sorry for that much text. I fell like every detail is important. Although i feel very tired and wanted to go to bed two hours ago already, i feel like i have to share my experience. Because it might be very valuable for anybody.

This is the first part of my reply(on your reply). I will write second part about tea and benzos.

And as always good luck to you all!

ToTheVoid

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #30 on: April 02, 2023, 05:11:34 PM »
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Yes, I also noticed that drinking warm tea would often temporary help with depression, but this would only last a few minutes at most, thus only a symptomatic aid. The same is true for taking warm baths.
Drinking warm tea is always a good idea for me. Because i am always cold. Whenever i have warm feet and i feel warm, my symptoms are decreased very much. And tea always helps.

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It would also exert a temporary inhibition on POIS and would often prevent or delay the evolution of more severe symptoms like chest inflammation.

"Evolution of more severe symtpoms" that actually scares me. Because my symptoms were always evolving. And now i feel already very bad. I actually don`t dare to ever do O again. I am afraid it will knock me down to the point from which i won`t be able to stand up even with the help of others.

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Similarly to you I also have problems with lifting weighs. I have less trouble when holding weighs, but when I want to lift them up, while holding them, I would experience a sudden increase in pain that would make me feel really weak and uncertain if I can hold it just another second more.
About holding something. I actually couldn`t hold anything for too long. I was very weak at it. I mean sometimes i couldn`t even hold my hands higher than my shoulders for 10 seconds. But the last time i experienced it, it was some time ago. Maybe two months ago maybe 3. Now i have more strength.

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Of course my colleges would often joke about how weak I am.

As i think of it they don`t want to understand you and they pretty much just mock you. I`ve seen your age is 38 and i believe you are responsible with your emotions but it`s very important to not make your situation worse by holding emotions inside. If i get laughed i will feel very very bad. In this POIS period the symptoms will be more severe. So i guess although it`s obvious don`t hold your emotions. Because otherwise it will make your situation worse.

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I found cold water showers equally beneficial
Same for me. But it helps with symptoms more. Not with the POIS itself. I understand you didn`t say it helps with the culprit of POIS but the thing is that in my case, as i already mentioned many times: hard physical work always helps. And getting warmer helps too. I mean i feel like it might be helping with the root cause. Because as i mentioned my hypothesis for my root cause of POIS is vessels+heart problems which make my O, arousal very hard(maybe energetically or in any other way) for the body. My theory is that maybe i don`t have enough blood supply to my testicles, especially left one(with varicocele).

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Please could you specify which benzo drug you used and in what dosage?
Gidazepam 20 mg sublingually. But i didn`t use it systematically. At first i didn`t even notice any effects. But it helped a little bit with anxiety in a low doses. And it worked somewhat strange. One time i tried splitting pill in half and i started to fall asleep. The other time i tried firstly 1 pill, then i took second pill, then third. I took four pills and maybe i became a little "sleeppy", tired. I feel like it depends on how much stress or panick or whatever you had. And i don`t really remember if it helped me with anxiety but i think it helped me with what i think is called panic attacks(when my heart starts to beat very strongly and loud, and it beats fast, i am very very angry, like i am threatened. I honestly want to punch someone, sorry for appearing to be a freak(i didn`t punch anyone, well yet and i hope it will remain "yet")). But usually when i take benzos i will be calm and just fall asleep.
But that is not the solution. It`s when you have a strong POIS attack and you want or need an instant relief. I mean you can`t work or study or socialise when you are asleep. Or in this 1-5% consiousness state.
Btw it feels kinda pleasant(considering what life with POIS is like) when you are laying and you don`t feel pain or almost don`t feel any pain, also when something like Deep Cover - Sun Araw is playing, from Hotline Miami(btw cool game series)
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The only one I took in the past is clonazepam (Rivotril) that I took for about 6 years. I had an incessant panic attack at the time and it partially helped with that, however at the same time it made practically all my POIS symptoms much worse, like I had a much stronger photophobia, muscle fatigue/pain, aphasia (incapability to recall words), short-term memory disorder. I think it also induced bloodshot eyes, but I had that practically all the time and this also happened more than 10 years ago, thus I can no longer recall the specifics.
Gidazepam specifically helped me with POIS triggered by anxiety, by stress, by arousal. But it didn`t ever make it worse. But i didn`t try it after masturbating because as i said i am afraid to do so.

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The best would be to try lorazepam myself to prove such a possibility, but the doctors consistently refuse to help me and I can’t get any prescription drugs for this reason.
Why doctors would want to help you?) They usually don`t f*ing care. I am going to a doctor very soon. I will try to get an appointment to a psychologyst(to ask and try other benzos and anti-depressants) and andrologyst. I will ask about lorazepam specifically but i doubt i will be able to buy them where i live. Can you please name something similar to lorazepam? And maybe you have any anti-depressants reccomendations?
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There were times when the phone was ringing loudly (alarm clock) for at least half an hour beside my bed before I even came around to recognize it to be so as I was so knocked out
I feel you. I had similar experience with benzos.(Not exactly like yours, but this "knocked out state")
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As you can see if benzos only affected the benzodiazepine receptors we could regard them as only benzos, but these drugs are nowhere near perfect and have many off target receptors as well, which could easily produce entirely different outcomes in our sensitized state.
I understand. I also understand that even though anti-depressants might actually help, that will not back up the stupid hypothesis about some psychosomatic nature of POIS. Because anti-depressants help with the very important system in our brains. And this system regulates many other different systems. Including one which will be connected to a root cause of POIS.

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I think I made it quite clear that most of the supplements I found to have an anti-depressive effect are in the best and good category. There is also nothing new here as most of these have been traditionally or anecdotally considered to have an anti-depressive effect.
Sorry, i haven`t noticed. I have worse attention and any other cognitive abilities not even in a POIS state. And also something with my eyes. I clearly can`t  see well when reading. Especially with something on monitor. I mean it`s a little hard for me to find a next row. I can easily lose a track. It`s one of many other eyes symptoms.

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At least I had some success with CBD oil, but even that one had contained other ingredients as well. It also has to be mentioned that THC may behave much differently than CBD and some people may actually experience worsening symptoms. Another supplement to try in this regard is saffron that also affects the endocannabinoid system. By the way you should also share your experience with weed if you had any.
I`ve seen posts of guys on reddit who took some CBD or weed(or is it the same thing, idk) and it either completely or significantly reduced their symptoms. That`s why i was asking. I am actually afraid to buy and smoke any weed since it`s illegal. But i think i will have to try in the future if nothing helps. I might try saffron. Thanks for piece of advice. Btw how to buy weed? Via friends or internet?

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I am sorry to say this, but nothing has ever solved my problems more than 80%. My list reflects a partly objective and partly subjective feeling that I had experienced with each supplement in an acute setting. If you want quality information I suggest you check out the methods of other members, who claim to have succeeded more. I said so before, but my aim is to do a quantity research even if it is less reliable. I think this is the only way to find out any correlations and associations to other cases and to possibly figure out the underlying mechanism.
Do you mean 80% of problems at one moment of time considering damage to eyes or maybe gut or something else, brains? Because my method(hard physical exercise) works with only at "this" point of time problems. It doesn`t help with damage which is already done to my system(or it seems like this. Maybe if i will be living super healthy and active lifestyle with hard physical exercises and without much stress, along with abstaining i might reverse eye damage and gut damage).And i guess you don`t have to be sorry. Sorry for what? You already did many experiments and contributed to POIS community very much. I know you know this without me. But i mean sorry for what.
 
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I am in no way connected to NORD and you should turn to demografx with any such questions:
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=3046.msg46488#msg46488
Ok
Anyway, thanks for your replies. I hope you and other POISers will be doing well. I am planning to share my experiences because i want to contribute to research and help in some ways i can, although i am already tired of printing these posts because it takes so much time and energy since i have you know what. Also i am trying to structurize my information in posts and make my messages easier to read and understand.
Good luck to you all!

Muon

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #31 on: September 07, 2023, 10:29:26 AM »
Attachment: Grade 2 Varicocele. Successful embolization on both venae spermaticae internae for varicocele.
Left side: based on the lack of a competent valve.
Right Side: based on renospermatic bypass in the presence of a competent valve.

And yes it's about NEs. I had small surgery done on me which has completely stopped me getting NEs. NEs was regularly bugging me and even feeling like near dumbstruck when awakening. Obviously if I feel aroused I could still get caught out but never again did I get it straight after awakening.

A few years back in 2014 and 2015 I was obsessed with seeing doctors to try find solutions for my POIS and it was a specialist as internist and endocrinologist (Dr Frank Comhaire) who came up with the idea. He send me to a urologist (Dr Jan Kunnen) for a small surgical procedure which they named as percutaneous transluminal embolization varicocele. I have not had any regret since getting this done and has probably saved me a lot of trouble. Obviously I still have POIS but at least glad to have gotten rid of the NEs. As far as I can remember the weeks after the surgery I could feel inside myself that my body had to adapt to a change. A sensation that was probably stressing my body a bit unless it was more psychological as far as I can remember but slowly adapted to the change. At the time these doctors had never heard of POIS. I only met the urologist once for the operation itself. I only had a discussion about 3 or 4 times with the endocrinologist before he had proposed this.

I hereby send you a report that was made at the time. You will note that the report has been written in dutch so apologies.
I erased my name on the report but I left the addresses of the doctors with their names. I did not ask them permission though if I could do this but I guess if ever it's free advertisement for them! I'm not sure if they still at the same addresses though!

I hope this info will also help someone.

Dr.Dre

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #32 on: February 29, 2024, 03:09:16 AM »
I had varicocele on the left side. After surgery, the varicocele was eliminated. My health condition deteriorated dramatically after that. I advise you not to have surgery!

b_jim

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #33 on: February 29, 2024, 07:46:15 AM »
Yes, left.

Do you get problems in that area during POIS b_jim?

I'm sorry for very late answer  ;D

No problem, no link with Pois. The problem never came back.
Taurine = Anti-Pois

Muon

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #34 on: March 28, 2024, 10:35:00 AM »
Beneficial effects of the first case of washed microbiota transplantation for postorgasmic illness syndrome: a case report
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B-type ultrasonography and brain magnetic resonance imaging showed the left varicocele and…

Muon

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #35 on: May 11, 2024, 08:55:55 AM »
https://www.reddit.com/r/POIS/comments/1cpeaxy/my_journey_to_overcoming_pois_a_personal_research/
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Successful Treatment:The link between varicocele and my symptoms led to a varicocelectomy, which has successfully resolved my POIS symptoms for several months now.

Hopeoneday

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2024, 04:25:37 AM »
I was wrong in varicocele in my case.
I tested last 5 times and confirmed 100% that pois in
day 2-3 if it is bad atac, induce varicocele in my right
testicle, with hemorrhoids to usually.

It can indicate that some blokade is happening in abdomen,
because wright testicle is suplyed by artery trought abdomen.

This varicocele is usually gone after 5-7 days, when
pois inflamation pass.

Dr-pois.

devastated

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #37 on: June 01, 2024, 11:59:07 PM »
I have serious varicocele on the left side and have been always wondering if there was a connection with POIS.
Did surgery improve anything for any of you?

By the way, here's what I found when I asked chatgpt-o about the matter:

Potential Mechanisms of Interaction

Hormonal Imbalance:

Varicocele Impact: Varicocele can affect testicular function, potentially leading to hormonal imbalances, particularly in testosterone and other androgens. These imbalances could influence sexual function and general well-being.
POIS Relevance: Hormonal changes, especially those related to androgens, might contribute to the symptoms experienced in POIS. There is some evidence suggesting that hormonal dysregulation can affect mood, energy levels, and cognitive function, which are key components of POIS.

Inflammatory Response:

Varicocele Impact: Varicocele is associated with increased scrotal temperature and oxidative stress, leading to an inflammatory response. This chronic inflammation could have systemic effects.
POIS Relevance: POIS symptoms often include signs of systemic inflammation, such as fatigue, muscle pain, and flu-like symptoms. An existing inflammatory state due to varicocele could exacerbate or trigger similar inflammatory pathways in POIS.

Immunological Factors:

Varicocele Impact: Varicocele might affect the blood-testis barrier, potentially leading to an autoimmune response where the body attacks its own sperm cells. This immunological disturbance could have broader implications.
POIS Relevance: One hypothesis for POIS is that it involves an autoimmune reaction to semen. If varicocele leads to increased autoimmunity related to sperm, it could theoretically exacerbate or trigger POIS symptoms.

Nervous System Involvement:

Varicocele Impact: The pain and discomfort associated with varicocele can lead to chronic stress and potentially alter the function of the autonomic nervous system.
POIS Relevance: The autonomic nervous system plays a significant role in both ejaculation and the subsequent recovery period. Dysregulation in this system could contribute to the onset or severity of POIS symptoms.

Summary and Conclusion
Based on the heuristic analysis, several potential mechanisms could link varicocele to POIS, including hormonal imbalances, inflammatory responses, immunological factors, and nervous system involvement. However, it is important to note that these connections are speculative and based on indirect evidence. More targeted research is necessary to establish a definitive link between varicocele and POIS.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2024, 12:18:44 AM by devastated »

Cosmic1982@

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #38 on: September 06, 2024, 01:55:52 AM »
Went for an ultrasound yesturday for the 3rd time and previously been diagnosed with vareocille but this time they have diagnosed me with Epididymal cyst which is an inflammation that sits on the testi.

I don't know whether this could be a result of the POIS or if it's causing the POIS.

Interesting topic x

Hopeoneday

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Re: Varicocele
« Reply #39 on: September 08, 2024, 08:54:18 AM »
God knows Cosmic, but there are one study of pois, operation of
epididymitis wich cured his pois.
Who knows, in my case it seams that pois inflamation creates
varicoceles etc...
« Last Edit: September 08, 2024, 02:27:24 PM by Hopeoneday »
Dr-pois.