Author Topic: An introduction to Prospero's case  (Read 34645 times)

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #60 on: March 06, 2022, 08:30:50 AM »
Thank you for this suggestion.

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #61 on: April 17, 2022, 09:36:11 AM »
Apart from this, I'm beginning an antibiotic treatment for my streptococcus infection, will post any result.

Just an update on this: no change in POIS, and I have done a new lab test some time after the 3-weeks treatment with beta-lactam antibiotic Cefixime. Infection with Streptococcus Anginosus was not detected in the sperm but abnormal "polymicrobial flora" was still there, so my urologist prescribed me a new 2-weeks treatment with Ofloxacin, a fluoroquinolone.
I'm somewhat reluctant as there are frequent problems with this kind of antibiotic (including with people here) but - well, I also need to get rid of these bacteria.

Another point: I've re-tried zinc supplementation after antibiotic use, this winter. Contrarily to my former trials, I got just a little POIS-fatigue symptoms and glans penis inflammation the first day and then it vanished (usually it would trigger tachycardia & big fatigue, and I could not bear it past the third day). I took it 10 days without problem, however my post-orgasmic symptoms seemed stronger (codeine and paracetamol didn't shut them down this time).

I'm taking zinc anew these days, it didn't trigger anything either, my mood even improved (probably due to the effect on serotonin), I'm also a bit less easily aroused sexually and pre-cum doesn't drop so quickly (arguably for the same reason, or is there a glutamate connection?), and post-sexual arousal symptoms seem to have dramatically weakened (I'm even wondering if I got any of them - maybe some mild pelvic pain). However my tachycardia episodes when falling asleep and/or waking up increased so I discontinued zinc for a few days.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2022, 01:11:28 PM by Prospero »

Muon

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #62 on: May 19, 2022, 03:07:17 AM »
Have you tried different forms of zinc?

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #63 on: May 19, 2022, 01:18:28 PM »
No, only zinc gluconate.

I can update what I've written 2 weeks ago. I've continued taking zinc and all my post-arousal symptoms have been suppressed (minus the one I'll discuss infra). I've tried to remain aroused for a long time, didn't get symptoms either. I've not tried to orgasm, and fortunately zinc also seems to have nuked my nocturnal emissions, although they already seemed to be less frequent since a few months.
Many permanent symptoms have vanished too: my breathing is better, although a little *less* better these days than it has been in the last weeks; I almost never feel my most strange "untimely sexual pleasure feelings in the brain", even if I try to "call them back" by thinking about it (but I still felt this peculiar feeling, at low intensity, hours after being aroused in a sustained manner).
Most impressively, as I have increased the dosage to 30 mg since 2 days, yesterday for the first time since at least a year I didn't get a sudden tachycardia attack when falling asleep. Usually I would really get this absolutely each time I'd fall asleep, even for a few seconds of drowsiness, and I would have to stand up, waiting for my heart to calm down, until I could retry, sometimes with many trials being necessary. I still need to confirm this new improvement in the long run.

Also, my cognitive abilities are better, notably my reflexes. I can measure this by playing a video game, I'm a lot better since I'm taking zinc. I had already noticed I was better when taking tramadol or codeine after an orgasm, and that I was worse after sexual arousal or orgasm without medication.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2022, 01:20:41 PM by Prospero »

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #64 on: June 19, 2022, 10:00:20 AM »
I stopped zinc not long after my former post, as I'm not willing yet to supplement for long periods of time (high zinc supplementation may lead to deficiencies in some parts of the brain, notably).
I've re-tried amino acids supplementation, which did have some of the beneficient effects of zinc, though not all. I had no post-arousal symptoms (but they came back after ceasing amino acids) and breathing was good, however improvements on mood, cognitive abilites, sleep/waking issues were less noticeable. Also, zinc had suppressed my unpleaseant body odour, dating from my teen years but particularly strong after sexual arousal, which reappeared then and wasn't reduced by amino acids.

Another remark: when I fall asleep and wake up quickly (with the problems described earlier), I have been noticing many times that my blood seems to build up around the areas which are pressed on the ground. I have big red zones on my skin, on the knees, the palm, the face... much more than the norm. This ends quickly when I stand up. This afternoon, I had fallen asleep with the edge of a book resting on one finger : I got a kind of small haematoma on this point. I didn't have this issue in the past. I wonder what it can mean. Is there a problem of coagulation? But why only when I fall asleep?

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #65 on: July 28, 2022, 06:17:04 PM »
After my three last orgasms, I didn't take any drug and had almost no POIS each time.

I still felt the usual immediate feelings just after orgasm: muscle weakness (and pain when I use them), a kind of fatigue and feeling like I've absorbed a poison (no euphoria at all...) but nothing happened then, the POIS cascade wasn't triggered, and in a few hours I forgot any bad feeling or fatigue.

The only thing I was taking was daily amino acids complex at the time (well, with some pauses, but the effect seems to have lasted even when I wasn't taking them as regards post-orgasmic illness). As my lab tests showed a deficiency in amino acids, there is almost no question that this was indeed what allowed for this impressive improvement of my POIS. Glutamine is the main component of the complex (see John21's experience with glutamine), but there are also all the other essential ones.

Still, if I stop amino acids (or zinc, but I didn't retry yet, I want to test my blood level of zinc first), my post-arousal symptoms are still there, although not very harmful, and generally speaking I don't tolerate arousal well. My problems when falling asleep are probably my main concern now (zinc 30 mg did stop them but...). My "pleasure intoxication" feelings in the head have withdrawn so far, but I still feel them somewhat in the hours after some sexual arousal so I know they didn't disapear. I'll start doing sport again to see if it doesn't mess anything.

I've been treated with antiobiotics for 2 weeks, my digestion was better during the period, but I feel that the effects are vanishing progressively now. I'll test my sperm as soon as I can to see if it solved the infection. I didn't feel any change regarding POIS and its spectrum of symptoms. Maybe - maybe - it was helping against post-arousal symptoms during the 2 weeks, but I'm not sure, and now that the treatment is finished my post-arousal symptoms are unchanged.

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #66 on: August 26, 2022, 04:00:53 PM »
I did a few new lab tests out of curiosity. Everything is in the normal range although ferritin and copper are quite low.

Ferritin : 62 ng/ml (30-300)
B1 : 152 nmol/L (83-245)
B2 / FAD : 200 nmol/L (174-471)
B2 / FMN : 15 nmol/L
B3 : 5,5 mg/L (3-6,3)
Copper : 738 mug/L (686-1596)
Zinc : 922 mug/L (553-1046)

My tests were done 2 months after my last intake of zinc supplementation so it shouldn't have marred the result too much (and I hadn't taken so many zinc supplements).


I currently do not experience POIS as such anymore, I can safely say it. No post-orgasmic symptoms. Almost no post-arousal symptoms, only (strong) pelvic pain if I stay aroused for a long time.

My post-arousal condition has improved much since I took zinc for two new weeks (after I did my blood tests). I have stopped now that I have received the results which show zinc is already high, but the gains against post-arousal symptoms remained so far. Wait and see. It's difficult to know what, in zinc supplementation, is effective. Higher serotonin, testosterone, catecholamines, immune functions, anti-glutamate and anti-excitotoxicity effects... So many possibilities.

As far as I know, amino acids depletion may have meant problems with energy metabolism (e.g. a pathogen disrupting the normal pathways and the body emptying aminos to compensate) or gut issues (impacting absorption). Whatever the reason can be, amino acids supplementation caused a dramatic improvement of my POIS. More people in this forum may want to try a blood test as regards this issue.

I feel that POIS is still there, not so far away, waiting for an occasion to reactivate. My body and brain still react not very healthily to stress and arousal. I sometimes feel the strange feeling of pleasure in my head, but only on days when I have masturbated.

I'll try to look in different directions : mainly immune boosting / pathogen killing supplements, potential deficiencies other than amino acids, anti-glutamate stuff.

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #67 on: September 30, 2022, 04:35:44 PM »
New sperm culture. This time, no bacteria was found. It looks like the fluoroquinolones worked.
In addition to this, my sperm is still rather yellowish but it's becoming more opaque and white.

I had two orgasms in 48h last week-end (one of them for the test) and was completely POIS-free. I was even feeling in better health than ever after the second one, with my breathing becoming completely normal and deep, and a very good mood in the two following days (even slight euphoria). This slight euphoria reminded me what I experienced sometimes when I took codeine, so I wonder if it's related to endorphins working normally this time.

However, I triggered a new orgasm this evening and clearly experienced some POIS. I felt weakened, endured mood changes (no euphoria...), shortness of breath and shivers.
I wonder what was different this time.

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #68 on: November 06, 2022, 07:59:37 PM »
Metabolic profiling reveals anomalous energy metabolism and oxidative stress pathways in chronic fatigue syndrome patients
"We propose that amino acids are being increasingly used to provide an adequate carbohydrate source for the citric acid cycle. We suggest that this is via glutamate forming 2-oxoglutarate through an enzyme that deaminates it and subsequently elevates blood aspartate. Dysfunctional energy metabolism appears to have impacted creatinine and its elevation in urine suggests that it may be used as an alternative for anaerobic ATP production within muscle. A decrease in blood hypoxanthine and an increase in urine allantoin further suggest the elevation of reactive oxygen species in ME/CFS patients."

Prospero, analysis from december 2020 : Urinary creatinine : 22,73 mmol/L (5.13 - 14.23) H

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #69 on: February 14, 2023, 01:55:07 PM »
So, after several months, I can tell that daily amino acids (a rather small quantity of them) still completely suppress post-orgasmic symptoms (I do not orgasm very often : usually once every 2 weeks, sometimes once every week - more AA might be necessary if I did it more often).

What is interesting is that if I catch a little pathogen which make me almost not sick (like an irritated throat...), an orgasm usually makes it worsen (and I get a real cold, etc.). It did it twice for covid, at least once for a flu, and many times for normal colds. It already did it in the past, but as I was sick with POIS too (usually - sometimes, precisely POIS wasn't triggered when I was already sick) it was harder to single out this effect. Now that I have zero POIS, I can see it clearly.

So I suspect that, at least for me, orgasm triggers a "transient immune deficiency", as nanna thought, even though the process may be different from the one he considered. Either some pathogen, or one latent pathogen in particular, or the immune response that follows, or the cause of the transient immune deficiency - consumes a lot of amino acids after orgasming (either directly or through ATP depletion, etc.), and the sudden deficiency produces "POIS symptoms".

Post-excitatory symptoms aren't linked to amino acids and still there, although taking zinc seems to prevent them to some extent (but not entirely). I suspect it's another consequence of the "original POIS cause", which may be linked to neurotransmitters, blood circulation, immune reactions.


berlin1984

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #70 on: February 15, 2023, 09:51:19 AM »
Sounds interesting. What are you taking in which dosage?

I didn't read in detail, but the tl;dr is you took antibiotics and now take amino acids and now you're ok?

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #71 on: February 15, 2023, 01:29:10 PM »
Yes, although I don't know if antibiotics did anything. It looks like amino acids and zinc, which seemed to do nothing or increase some symptoms before antibiotics, had a different impact afterwards, but it could be unrelated.

My current daily supplementation is : Glutamine 140 mg, aspartic acid 80 mg, histidine 75 mg, leucine 75 mg, methionine 75 mg, isoleucine 75 mg, lysine 75 mg, phenylalanine 75 mg, threonine 50 mg, alanine 42 mg, valine 41 mg, serine 40 mg, proline 40 mg, tyrosine 26 mg, arginine 20 mg, cystine 20 mg, glycine 15 mg.
I'm going to test my blood amino acids anew in the next weeks.

If I stop taking them, after a few orgasms the usual POIS symptoms come back.

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #72 on: August 29, 2023, 04:27:58 PM »
So, I did the amino acids test I was supposed to do in March, after a few months taking AA supplementation. Most values are back in the reference range, sometimes in the low part of it but still.
A few of them are still very low : Aspartic Acid is a mystery, it's in my supplementation in quite a high quantity. Cystine and alanine are in my supplement but in a lesser dosage. Ethanolamine wasn't included.
Glutamine is in high dose in my pills and I've now too much of it so I'll stop and try to find other formulas.
Whatever, I've had 3 orgasms without symptoms since I did the test and stopped the supplementation (and of course I had no symptoms when I was supplementing), so I guess that these values, taken globally, are sufficient. As far as I know, it will not last long, though, and my amino acids levels may well be falling already. I don't know where I'm heading in the long run, but it's still a very interesting outcome for all this experimentation.

Taurine 42 ?mol/l N : 30 - 116
Phospho?thanolamine 2 ?mol/l N : < 4
Acide Aspartique 4 ?mol/l N : 42 - 72
Hydroxyproline 9 ?mol/l N : < 37
Thr?onine 114 ?mol/l N : 97 - 197
S?rine 126 ?mol/l N : 101 - 177
Acide Glutamique 28 ?mol/l N : 40 - 120
Glutamine 598 ?mol/l N : 220 - 550
Acide Aminoadipique 2 ?mol/l
Proline 190 ?mol/l N : 152 - 226
Glycine 225 ?mol/l N : 181 - 293
Alanine 242 ?mol/l N : 286 - 416
Citrulline 27 ?mol/l N : 20 - 34
Valine 225 ?mol/l N : 213 - 283
Cystine 21 ?mol/l N : 65 - 109
M?thionine 26 ?mol/l N : 21 - 35
Isoleucine 64 ?mol/l N : 54 - 78
Leucine 134 ?mol/l N : 109 - 153
Tyrosine 52 ?mol/l N : 50 - 76
Ph?nylalanine 59 ?mol/l N : 43 - 65
GABA <2 ?mol/l
Homocystine <2 ?mol/l N : < 2
Ethanolamine 8 ?mol/l N : 26 - 92
Ornithine 70 ?mol/l N : 50 - 100
Lysine 160 ?mol/l N : 157 - 231
1-M?thylhistidine 4 ?mol/l N : < 2
Histidine 80 ?mol/l N : 73 - 97
3-M?thylhistidine 4 ?mol/l N : < 6
Arginine 76 ?mol/l N : 61 - 103
Allo-isoleucine 3 ?mol/l N : < 2
« Last Edit: August 29, 2023, 04:31:23 PM by Prospero »

Muon

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #73 on: August 30, 2023, 06:10:14 PM »
https://www.planetayurveda.com/library/aspartic-acid/

"Amino acids helps in the removal of excess ammonia from the body so aspartic acid deficiency may result in elevated levels of ammonia in the blood."

Exercise can increase ammonia levels in the blood.
https://journals.physiology.org/doi/abs/10.1152/ajplegacy.1964.207.6.1242

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #74 on: September 02, 2023, 02:55:16 PM »
Thank you Muon, interesting. I think that I'm going to try some more aspartic acid and see.

Muon

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #75 on: February 07, 2024, 04:51:30 PM »
Loperamide, Imodium helped him with POIS (selective peripheral mu-opioid agonist)
https://www.reddit.com/r/POIS/comments/1ah6c15/loperamide_helped_me/
"It's probably been a month since I tried it from pois. This was enough for me to observe that there was a positive effect. An important question regarding the dosage is approximately 2 tablets of 2 mg at a time before lunch and two in the evening. And this is enough for me to feel like a healthy person. I'm still in the process of learning, but I already wanted to share this information. If you take it before orgasm, then the symptoms of pois do not occur, if after orgasm, as soon as you start to feel bad, I drink it and after about 30 minutes everything is fine."
Have you tried Loperamide?

Prospero

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Re: An introduction to Prospero's case
« Reply #76 on: February 22, 2024, 04:56:06 PM »
No, nice find. I would surely not take it on a regular basis as I'm already chronically constipated and don't want to play too much with opioids, but it may be worth a try.

Currently I only take amino acid complex just after orgasm (i.e. once or twice a month) to be ~95% POIS-free.
The 5%: still a little fatigue and "unjoyfulness" on day 2 ; and most of all, notable inflammation of glans penis and foreskin after precum (+) and ejaculation (++++).
I've thought somewhat about mTOR these days, as glutamine seems to interact quite much with it.

My main concern these months is quite dissociated from common post orgasmic symptoms but I know it's POIS-related: something like long-term stress which makes me :
- sleep badly (I wake up frequently, mostly starting from 5 am, with unusual thirst)
- be under some kind of inner tension / feverishness all the time, although it's purely physiological and not related to psychosocial causes or consequences. I can feel it in particular in the way it constricts my breath
- lose hair (it's probably linked - at least it is on a chronological level)

It varies in intensity randomly. I know it's related to POIS because:
- it began last September just after a time of sexual arousal, more intensely at the time than now, but it never ceased
- I used to have similar episodes in previous times as one kind among my possible post-sexual arousal POISes, but it only lasted a few days or weeks and was linked to other post-arousal symptoms.

I'd like to investigate cortisol levels for these issues, although I don't have all symptoms of elevated cortisol (I never gain weight...). No idea about what else to test.

Also, semen is still yeallowish and watery. As it's not attributable to bacterial infection anymore, I guess it points to some other cause of oxidization.

Hah, and I have taken vitamin D3 caps during all winter without triggering the symptoms it used to trigger in the past. All this thing is so strange...
« Last Edit: February 22, 2024, 05:13:35 PM by Prospero »