Monte case - my POIS (some symptoms are strange)

[Monte]

Hi everyone, this is my first post 

Age: 38

Job: mental / creative

For many years I belived that I`m only hard overworked, I discovered POIS while practicing nofap.

Illnesses:
- when I was a kid - Staphylococcus aureus (not many symptoms, mainly in throat)
- since I was 19 ? symptoms like in inflammation of the prostate gland (I take no drugs for it because symptoms 1-2 times in month for 1-3 hours, from time to time control visit by urologist); I have not often prostate symptoms till today (also weak urine stream, but it could be worse)
- since I was 29 ? POIS (but then I didn`t know trigger is ejaculation)

Other illnesses:
- gastritis (under control when there are not triggers; not good reaction for IPP, good for silage like sauerkraut juice; no helicobacter)
- allergy to pollen, animal hair, certain foods
- few times in year I have otitis (infection in one ear) ? not strong symptoms (only ache, I don`t take drugs for it)
- often a sore throat after waking (even if not snoring)

Triggers:
- ejaculation (causes strong POIS)
- varnish vapors (cause weak or medium POIS and medium or strong gastritis for about 7days)
- nail polish fumes (cause weak or medium POIS and medium or strong gastritis for about 7 days)
- oil paint vapors (cause weak or medium POIS and medium or strong gastritis for about 7 days)
- window cleaner (cause weak POIS and weak medium gastritis for about days)
- some medicaments and suplements (cause gastritis)
- black coffee ? in first minutes makes me feel good (dopamina), but later only worse (less dopamina and rising / eliminated calcium)

Symptoms in POIS:
deterioration of cognitive processes
higher voice
speech problems
shadows under eyes
intellectual decline
worse creativity
emotional and social problems
sensitivity to stimuli (sound, touch, light)
annoyance
tingling in extremities
jumping muscles, trembling muscles
impaired motor skills and manual skills (worse car driving, longer bulb replacement in car etc.)
postponing decisions
pain in the whole body (bones, muscles)
a feeling of inflammation in the body and brain

Effective treatment (reducing symptoms in POIS):
- calcium (number one) - eliminates problems with legs pains, makes positive mood, improves mental problems, makes my voice lower, helps to regain balance disturbed by taking other supplements; not good for my stomach,of course too much calcium is not good for heart and kidneys so when I`m not in POIS I don`t take it everyday
- sauerkraut juice ? antioxidant, eliminates inflammation, makes all positive, good for my stomach and intestines
- grain coffe (vit. B, magnesium and other microelements) ?is really great but only 1 or 2 cups a day, more is toxic for me
- water with salt (I was shocked when I discovered that salty things make me better); sometimes (rare situation) after eating banana (potas) I have pain in chest (not strong) and arrhythmia; then I drink water with salt and then is ok
- multivitamin (include niacin) ? I take only crumb from time to time - sometimes makes salutary effect but sometimes makes worse
- fenugreek ? best results when I`m not in POIS (creativity, lower voice, good mood, but helpful even in POIS)
- lactobacillus ? good for my hole stomach but no results in POIS (maybe taking too short)

Other informations about drugs and suplements:
- vitamin C ? not always good for me (sometimes makes me better like more effective breathing but sometimes makes me little POISy)
- niacin ? taking large doses of niacin is not possible because of stomach pain (sometimes I take little doses but not spectacular effect)
- vit. B complex ? sometimes makes better (only in small doses), normal doses are not good for me
- zinc ? very good but only in small doses (normal doses are to toxic or it`s because of competing too much with calcium and I know in POIS I lose all my calcium (then taking antagonist like zink in normal doses is very risky)
- vit. D ? very good only in very small doses and only while taking calcium; bog doses make me feel very bad
Shower (many of you have POIS symptoms after hot shower):
- I`ve noticed only itching eyes (not classic POIS) but I`m allergic so I think pollen comes to my eyes while washing, I haven`t also negative emotional reactions for hot shower; warm water in bath sometimes gives help for my prostate

Other information:
- not too bad libido on POIS (but little worse than without POIS), erection is ok
- not too bad total testosterone level (it`s strange because in POIS I have higher voice), I`m waiting for free testosterone test results.

Discovered positive sides of calcium was very important thing to me. Once a time I was preparing myself for my cousins` wedding and I was in POIS. Magnesium didn`t help, multivitamin (with small dose of niacin) din`t work, and then I take supplement with calcium mixed with vit. D. Then I couldn`t belive but  brainfog, bad mood and pain was gone and the wedding was really great time for me. I belived that I found an antidotum for my bad condition (I thought that I have just calcium deficiency and I should just refill it, I didn`t know that is beginning of such a war). But till today calcium is one of my most important allies.

Kids:
- I have 1 kid (3 years old)
- want more kids if possible

I`ve never tried to use any prepack before orgasm (I found this forum 2 days ago and I didn`t know method with prepacks).
I can see that I am sensitive to fluctuations in the balance of microelements. For example now I`m in 8th day of POIS and normally I would have been OK, but this time I`ve tried magnesium and l-dopa and it wasn`t  good move. Symptoms are going too long (but I see now it`s ending).

I know one thing ? for me always good are:
- calcium
- sauerkraut juice
- grain coffee (many natural microelements)

I see my POIS has elements characteristic for different types of POIS. It can be associated with hormones (higher voice), but I have not bad libido and not bad testosterone? It can be also autoimmune (strange reaction for fumes) or bacteriological - problems with prostate (but I had urine and semen seeding for bacteria and it was ok).
I eat no sugar for 3 years, no bread for 1 month (and hardly weat), I have also separate diet and it all works but.. not when I`m in POIS.

I was hoping that my case might direct you, but I see that it seems to be too vague
Any way I`m happy that I can meet such people like you all.
What do you friends think of it - what type of POIS can it be?
I will try quercetin, NAC. Should Something else to my prepack? I will speak maybe with my urologist to try something anti-inflammatory. Any suggestions?

[Journey]

NoO triggers look as chemical sensitivity. I got 90% same POIS. Anything different n life that might've caused it when u got it?

[Muon]

I see mast cell problems.

S. aureus can tap into allergic pathways. It can induce IL-8.
https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2695.msg35824#msg35824

Human Mast Cell Activation by Staphylococcus aureus: Interleukin-8 and Tumor Necrosis Factor Alpha Release and the Role of Toll-Like Receptor 2 and CD48 Molecules

There might be something going on with intracellular calcium instead of extracellular.

Don't bother talking about mast cells with your doctor, you will waste your time. Their knowledge is limited to tryptase and histamine.

Any suggestions?

Yes, ask your urologist to test for IL-8 in seminal fluid (sIL-8):
Interleukin 8 and the male genital tract

[Clues]

Welcome to the forum, Monte!

If you want to explore a potential mast cell link, I suggest trying out a diet compatible with MCAS (Mast Cell Activation Syndrome). Some info here for example. Lots of info around the web, but don't freak out and eliminate too many things all at once!

Good luck on your journey.

[berlin1984]

I don't think mast cells are THE cause here.
Sure, they are involved, but they are involved in a lot of things?

If he likes sauerkraut juice, then he can tolerate histamine, tyramine etc.

(Please correct me if i'm wrong..)

How is your digestion?
How is your dental health?


EDIT: And the Tyramine in sauerkraut juice can make epinephrine and norepinephrine?!
https://medium.com/@sheamatthewfisher/why-a-hot-dog-with-cheese-and-sauerkraut-could-make-you-a-nervous-wreck-1b11e03eede6

[Monte]

Some more informations.
Journey - you ask about important things in my life that could be also the reason of POIS.
Yes there was one more thing - I think it could be important too.
One time I had to work in a room, in which earlier some workers painted walls. They were painting lamperia. Paints of workers were awful chemicals with aggressive smell. I was working there 8 hours few days. I was sleeping in my own house, the again I spent in these fumes many hours. I was sick of that (headache, generally feeling unwell, even little body shakes), but It was not as bad for me to go to doctor or laying in bed. I had always normal libido (maybe in POIS little worse). Evenings after being in toxic room I had masturbation/sex in my house. So then my organism could have shock when I was poisoned and achieving orgasm.
Few days after that I get gastritis. I don`t know how long after that I got strong POIS, because then I had stressful time in my office job and I had public speaking and long time I was thinking that I`m stressed and overworked. Then I decided to lead a healthy life. I was discovering new treatment methods and after years I get much better. Sometimes my illness was coming back and I don`t know why (I thought because of microelement deficiency or stress), but when I decided to nofap I discovered that my bad feeleing is mainly after orgasm.
I don`t think that the moment with paints was the first time when my organism decided by POIS, because the allergy, Staphylococcus aureus, problems with prostate, also little problems with concentrate were earlier.

 I remember when I was in college and one time when I was coming back from school I met my history teacher. He was going in the same direction so we were going together and talking to each other. I told him that last time I`m lethargic and sleepy. After orgasm I din`t want to do anything (of course I didn`t told my teacher about orgasms).
Thousands of workers work hole life in paints fumes and so small percentage has strong POIS. We must have specific predisposition or in our lives has something specific happened.
Anyway I think the episode with paints brought symptoms to another level.
More things which I am reminded of it now
-   brainfog after eating sweet things (so I don`t eat nothing sweet except some fruits)
-   high ALAT  (now in healthy life), but not the worst
-   sometimes high and sometimes low PSA results
Last time when I have sex rare, I have no issues with prostate. It is strange because I know that prostate likes ejaculates from time to time.

Teeths:
At the worst time of my pois (8 years ago) my teeth started to break down , but when I started to supplement calcium this process stopped and now it's quite ok.

Digestion:
Thanks to the sauerkraut juice, my digestion is fine. If I don't drink it, I tend to be constipated.
Drinking it causes also that I get calm.

[Journey]

Yes there was one more thing - I think it could be important too.

Interesting. Many POISers got allergies, ear/neck infections, gut, prostate problems, elevated liver enzymes, is it due to POIS or cause of POIS? POIS is linked with gut/MCAS/immunity, there are such patterns. Many got it after stress. POIS could be due to an external stress (physical, psychological) rewiring immunity/mast cells to activate during O or in response to a thing released in O.

[Muon]

Thousands of workers work their whole life in paints fumes and so small percentage has strong POIS. We must have specific predisposition or in our lives has something specific happened.
Anyway I think the episode with paints brought symptoms to another level.

Ref
Definitions:
Endogenous: having an internal cause or origin.
Exogenous: having an external cause or origin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37GtfXOP8dw&feature=youtu.be&t=765

[Journey]

Thousands of workers work their whole life in paints fumes and so small percentage has strong POIS. We must have specific predisposition or in our lives has something specific happened.
Anyway I think the episode with paints brought symptoms to another level.

Ref
Definitions:
Endogenous: having an internal cause or origin.
Exogenous: having an external cause or origin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37GtfXOP8dw&feature=youtu.be&t=765

How 2 fix MCAS?

[Kit]

I can’t believe calcium helps you with Vit D. That’s great to hear!

[Monte]

Today I have discovered new thing! I had no POIS since 2 months and today first time in my life I put on a glove and looked for a prostate. I touched, but didn't massage too much. I did it delicately, but after that I felt a slight burning sensation around my penis (last months I had no sympoms of prostatis, but of course touching prostate can make little irritate, so that`s normal) . But know the most important thing - few hours later I felt 30% POIS (but only brainfog, irritation and intellectual decline, no body pain). I think touching my prostate cased moving fluid in that area (but no leakage to the outside) and then has arisen inflammation (without pain). Maybe many of you have bacteria inflammation  and don`t know about it. I have taken 2 pills of drotaverine (probably is not as good as Prednisone but it`s the only thing I have) and now my brainfog is much smaller. I think I made an mistake touching prostate not being in POIS. I should make it (better drainage) only when I`m after sex (the prostate is anyway irritated so after sex probably  I'm not losing anything by massaging prostate). Anyway, good to know that there such a strange mechanism (maybe not the only one, but definitely contributing) causing my POIS. Now all make sense. Maybe that`s because people have good result after using Prednisone (reducing inflammation) and milnacipran (affecting the effective removal of secretions outside), even magnesium (making good perineal muscles action).

[Muon]

Mast cell activation by pressure.

[Journey]

Mast cell activation by pressure.

POIS due to prostate mast cell?

[Muon]

Mast cell activation by pressure.

POIS due to prostate mast cell?

No, POIS is mast cell activation by sexual triggers. Other triggers leading to POIS should be read as other triggers leading to mast cell activation IMHO. That's my take.

[Quantum]

Your description of your POIS in your first post is very interesting, especially the fact that calcium makes a real difference for you.

I, too, use a lot of electrolytes for my POIS, and they help me a lot.
I always take potassium and magnesium in my pre-pack ( https://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2090.msg16604#msg16604).   I have often bee using salted water in the past, too, because POIS causes me hypotension ( low blood pressure), and salted water helps raises blood pressure ( I have no kidney problems, so salt intake is not dangerous for me).
Calcium is not in my POIS pre-pack, but I use it after sport.  I have symptoms similar to POIS after sport, like fatigue and hypotension.  It gets a lot better if I take potassium, magnesium, salted water ( for sodium and chlorine), and calcium, in much higher dosage than in simple sport drinks like Gatorade or else.  In particular, my potassium intake must be very significant - no drink has enough for me.  I take around 250mg of calcium, sometime 500mg, and that's enough for me.

I live pretty up North, summer is very short here, so I take vitamin D daily all year long, 2000ui a day.

[b_jim]

Hi, Monte.

You make me think I had calcium complement (given by M.D.) just before Pois start (~13/14 years old).

Do you think Sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3) instead of salted water (NaCl) will help you ?
I simply wonder which is the helping element (Na or Cl).

[Monte]

Guys i'm grateful to all of you that you have written in this topic. I am taking every suggestion into consideration.

Hi b_jim, you mean you think you could have problems with calcium in past... If you still have symptops (now / in POIS) like as during latent tetany you can make test - if you will be in 2nd or 3th day in POIS (at least at apogee or shortly after) you can take any suplement with calcium + D3 (or only calcium) and you will see if taking calcium will knock you out of your bad condition. If not, you can add some Mg. If still not, that means it`s not calcium deficiency / not only calcium deficiency / eventualy you have to complement it longer (or in another confoguration, for example first multivitamin and after that calcium). For me calcium works immediately. It`s very difficult to catch the right balance in between Ca / Mg / D3. You can add

b_jim -  I didn`t try sodium bicarbonate when I was in POIS (so I don`t know if it works). I was taking it only just in case for the antibacterial and anti-fungal effect.

But now listen all (I will write it in another topic but here I`m going to write it too because I think it`s important) - I have read some topics here and some of them remids me, that in my youth I had herpes on my penis... I was calling my mom today and I ask her if she remember how old I was then. She told that i was 18 or 19 but I think I was younger beacuse I was at the doctor with her to show that.. Doctor has prescribed an ointment and that`s all. I forget about it till today... You know that means that theory about herpes can be true.

So I will add to my prepack aciclovir.
I modificated my prepack (even not tried the older version), now I took this configuration:

- aciclovir
- Excedrin (an equivalent in my country with similar proportions)
- vit. C
- allegra
- ibuprofen
- NAC
- taurine
- drotaverin
- EPA and vit. D3 (these for few days, also in prepack)

Today is a big  day

[Muon]

"Synergism has also been reported between flavonoids and other antiviral agents. Quercetin, for example, potentiates the effects of 5-ethyl-2?-dioxyuridine [11] and acyclovir [53] against HSV and pseudorabies infection. Apigenin also enhances the antiviral activity of acyclovir against these viruses [53]."

Antimicrobial activity of flavonoids

Flavonoids: promising natural compounds against viral infections

[Monte]

Thank Muon, I will think about flavonoids
Unfortunately,  I can`t add quercetin (even though I bought) because now I'm trying for a baby but I will search some other flavonoids to add next time!

[Muon]

Btw how did your doctor determine it was herpes? Did he run any test? Let me guess the doctor did not run a single test.