Author Topic: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory  (Read 15992 times)

demografx

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #60 on: September 28, 2019, 05:15:28 PM »
Fox, some of us - including me - have hypothesized that physical trauma may contribute to POIS. For some people. In my particular case, a surgical correction to an undescended testicle at birth. Any thoughts would be more than welcome.

Demo, Very much agree that POIS is a reaction to Physical Trauma.  Very interesting to hear that you had testicular surgery prior to getting POIS.

Thanks, Animus!
« Last Edit: September 28, 2019, 07:06:02 PM by demografx »
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

kingfisher

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #61 on: September 29, 2019, 07:33:52 AM »

On the topic of Diet, which is very interesting... I have an observation to add. I don't know if it's relevant to others as well... But I found, and still find, that eating lots of meat- Protein- will have the effect of stimulating my sexual functions.  So when I had POIS, and I ate a lot of meat for dinner- I would feel an unusually strong urge to have sex.  By a lot of meat- I mean, more than say 1/2 a pound, approaching 1 pound. 

Just speculating, but I wonder if becoming vegetarian would have a beneficial effect on POIS? and if there are any vegetarian members here who may have noticed something. Any thoughts?

Animus, my experience has been that a vegetarian diet does absolutely nothing for my pois. Even if I eliminate anything that makes me horny, pois symptoms will always occur. 

Muon

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #62 on: September 29, 2019, 10:42:23 AM »
Did they measure that in your family?
No and I don't recognize myself in the overal symptomatic picture of ceruloplasmin/copper related diseases.

The response to daktarin you described is interesting, I have never seen that before. I have to think about that.
My GP called an institute that track these kind of side effect reports and I was the only one who reported this kind of behaviour.

I don't know very much about IL17 either, so I have to read a bit about that.
My brother got the combination of low tryptophan, low serotonin and low IL-17. C. Albicans is able to downregulate IL-17 by affecting tryptophan metabolism:
Candida albicans Dampens Host Defense by Downregulating IL-17 Production

Since my throat was not affected but the mouth was:
Th17 cells and IL-17 receptor signaling are essential for mucosal host defense against oral candidiasis

So what might have happened that day is that IL-17 dropped down. C. Albicans might have capitalized on that. Candida itself might have suppressed IL-17 on top of that synergizing. This downregulation might have affected the Treg/Th17 axis. Function or numbers of Tregs could have been altered, thus affecting immune tolerance and thus led to a reaction to Daktarin. I respond to many things so this is no surprise. I wonder if the oral ,throat mucosal responses to food for instance share the same cause as POIS.

Could also be possible that the die off toxins in the swallowed Daktarin signaled the mucosal surfaces further down the line. The stuff was also very sweet. I had problems with sugar as well at that time.

If this pathway plays a role then the cause may also lie further upstream as in dopamin metabolism/release. Or unstable mast cells caused a reaction to Daktarin gel.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2019, 10:57:39 AM by Muon »

Animus

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #63 on: September 29, 2019, 09:31:49 PM »

On the topic of Diet, which is very interesting... I have an observation to add. I don't know if it's relevant to others as well... But I found, and still find, that eating lots of meat- Protein- will have the effect of stimulating my sexual functions.  So when I had POIS, and I ate a lot of meat for dinner- I would feel an unusually strong urge to have sex.  By a lot of meat- I mean, more than say 1/2 a pound, approaching 1 pound. 

Just speculating, but I wonder if becoming vegetarian would have a beneficial effect on POIS? and if there are any vegetarian members here who may have noticed something. Any thoughts?

Animus, my experience has been that a vegetarian diet does absolutely nothing for my pois. Even if I eliminate anything that makes me horny, pois symptoms will always occur.

Thanks for the response, Kingfisher

Muon

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #64 on: September 30, 2019, 06:25:51 AM »

Nas

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #65 on: September 30, 2019, 08:32:41 AM »
Gluten Protein Alters Brain Prolactin
It mentions that gluten behaves like an opioid chemical that excretes prolactin.
obviously in order for prolactin to stay high, dopamine should stay low.
So this makes me quite intrigued with the effect of opioids/endorphins in POIS. 
« Last Edit: September 30, 2019, 08:35:54 AM by Nas »

b_jim

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #66 on: September 30, 2019, 09:17:53 AM »
WOW! Brillant !
I never tested my prolactine.

Dispite I'm negative for celiac disease, gluten may be the culprit of my digestive problems. But I need to test fodmaps too.
Bone soup (= glutamine? collagen ?) cleans my intestine, cure my stomach gastritis. Best method I've found.

But gluten clearly give me bloatings, abdominal pains, diarrheas.

Good job guys.
Taurine = Anti-Pois
Suffering from lyme disease

Hopeoneday

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #67 on: September 30, 2019, 09:40:23 AM »
Elevated prolactin is comon patern in poisers.
Dr-pois.

demografx

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #68 on: September 30, 2019, 10:10:22 AM »
Next time I blood-test my testosterone levels, can they easily test my prolactin, too?
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

b_jim

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #69 on: September 30, 2019, 10:26:16 AM »
Yes. It"s an easy blood test parameter.

Taurine = Anti-Pois
Suffering from lyme disease

demografx

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #70 on: September 30, 2019, 11:03:32 AM »
Thank you, b_jim
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

Muon

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #71 on: September 30, 2019, 06:39:01 PM »
Next time I blood-test my testosterone levels, can they easily test my prolactin, too?
I'm surprised they haven't done this yet since T is low.

So this makes me quite intrigued with the effect of opioids/endorphins in POIS. 
I had some events where I almost became stoned from an orgasm for an hour long. I did feel peacefully and stimuli from the environment had less effect, like you couldn't feel the wind rushing by when walking outside and sounds had less impact. Also I could not feel any pain as if I had taken a painkiller. I played a videogame many years ago where an effect was shown which had some in common with what I experienced: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlG9xdbRu6Y
Compare the sound of the shotgun after the adrenaline shot and when he walks up the stairs at the end. It's just like that.
Endorphins/Adrenaline/dopamine???
« Last Edit: September 30, 2019, 06:49:56 PM by Muon »

Nas

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #72 on: October 01, 2019, 12:34:33 AM »
The thing is, opioid withdrawal theory is one of the suggested causes of POIS in some of the literature. However our symptoms do not fully align with opioid withdrawal. Still I would be very intrigued to try a low dose Naltrexone trial. Too bad it's not available in my country.

b_jim

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #73 on: October 01, 2019, 02:23:46 AM »
99% of chance my yellow stools are caused by gluten.
I've stopped gluten 6 days ago and day after day I go back to the normal... Dispite I'm negative for celiac.
Blood test results soon.

Update : bloodtest is good except 1 liver paramater a bit too high and moderate hyperkalemia, strange :/
Update : creatinine ok. Maybe eat too much bananas  ;D


Quote
You don't have to be celiac to be intolerant to gluten b_jim

Thanks, Iwillbeatthis. I will follow Fox strategy and avoid gluten during 3 months. In fact, it is possible that I will suppress gluten for the rest of my life. I don't want yellow stool and blood come back.
Maybe it will help my Pois too with a better absorption.
I'm not fine with this hyperkalemia but maybe it's normal.

« Last Edit: October 02, 2019, 02:23:10 AM by b_jim »
Taurine = Anti-Pois
Suffering from lyme disease

Iwillbeatthis

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #74 on: October 01, 2019, 06:37:38 AM »
You don't have to be celiac to be intolerant to gluten b_jim

Muon

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #75 on: October 01, 2019, 07:09:25 AM »
Gluten Protein Alters Brain Prolactin
It mentions that gluten behaves like an opioid chemical that excretes prolactin.

You could generalize this further: Food Proteins as Source of Opioid Peptides-A Review

They can induce wheals and flares: Wheal and flare responses to opioids in humans.

My mother can have big wheals on her arms that spontanuously pop up and go. I believe I have pictures of them somewhere. The POIS positive skin testing could be an opioid related mechanism in some people.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2019, 07:17:26 AM by Muon »

Nas

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #76 on: October 01, 2019, 07:40:38 AM »

You could generalize this further: Food Proteins as Source of Opioid Peptides-A Review

They can induce wheals and flares: Wheal and flare responses to opioids in humans.

My mother can have big wheals on her arms that spontanuously pop up and go. I believe I have pictures of them somewhere. The POIS positive skin testing could be an opioid related mechanism in some people.

You should focus on endorphin behavior. They play a role in excitement/stress/arousal/sex/ and even smoking which induces POIS for me.
Low dose Naltrexone can tell us a lot if it had an impact on our symptoms.

Muon

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #77 on: October 01, 2019, 09:25:59 AM »
My mother can have big wheals on her arms that spontanuously pop up and go. I believe I have pictures of them somewhere.
I think I'm confused with these definitions. It's a big red spot on her arm, not sure about the terminology.

demografx

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #78 on: October 01, 2019, 10:41:51 PM »

Next time I blood-test my testosterone levels, can they easily test my prolactin, too?


I'm surprised they haven't done this yet since T is low.


No. It’s *not* been low since 2009. With TRT.
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

Bob Morane

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Re: Leaky gut, leaky brain theory
« Reply #79 on: October 06, 2019, 10:54:24 AM »
As a reply to Quantum

My DNA report shows Histamine related SNPs and I think it is directly related to POIS (at least for me)

"The DAO and HNMT genes both encode enzymes responsible for the breakdown of histamine within your body.
? You have genetic variants in the HNMT gene associated with reduced function, meaning that you may have
reduced ability to break histamines down effectively following exposure to environmental allergens."

I have noticed in the past how very similar my POIS symptoms are compared to histamine intolerance symptoms. It all makes sense to me since my POIS began specifically after a one month medical treatment with 3 different antibiotics at age 34. It severely damaged my microbiome and my ability to deal with histamine breakdown. Leaky gut, SIBO, dysbiosis... Immediately after this treatment I began reacting to high histamine foods and also I began suffering from POIS (although at that time in pre-internet 1986 I had no idea what was going on - it took me many years to figure it out). After ejaculation, I develop the same types of symptoms I get after ingestion of histamine rich foods, especially if a high level of stress is present (which also seems to contribute to increase histamine production). I have been periodically dealing with SIBO and other related conditions ever since. I am now 67 years old, so that was 33 years ago! Prior to this antibiotic exposure I had a very active sexual life without any issues at all. No POIS at all.

Needless to say I have been experimenting with stress reduction techniques, diet, probiotics and various supplements. I have had periods with very low level of POIS symptoms but as soon as I am in a difficult stressful situation or if I expand my diet to include more histamine rich foods (while traveling for example) or if my microbiome gets into a state of dysbiosis for various reasons, I need to redo all the work with a strict diet, positive neuroplasticity exercises (similar to meditation), and supplement with probiotics and more. This is where I am at currently.

The more we learn the better we can focus our actions and get results. Thanks for sharing your experience.

Hi Fox, and welcome to the forum !

I agree that many members had improvement when turning to a more healthy diet.  Better nutrition is part of my own overall relief method.  No more industrial food, no more MSG, no more aspartame, no more artificial flavor or color, no more refined sugar.  And, for 4 years now, my green smoothies of organic veggies and fruits are an essential part of my diet.   I have more energy now at 54 than I had at 35 :)  I think a healthier diet would help anybody, not just POIS sufferers, so it is a logical first step for any POIS sufferer.

Talking about healthy gut, did you tried some probiotics supplements with both strains of lactobacillus and strains of bifidus ?  Flooding the guts with good bacteria really helps getting rid of the methane-producing ones.   Clindamycine can help in theory to get rid of anaerobic bacteria, but after antibiotherapy is finished, the bacteria left will occupy the free space again, with time.

Channelopathies have been briefly discussed here.  I do not exclude that it may be part of what causes my POIS, because taking potassium really helps with my fatigue, both for POIS and after physical exercise.  As you mention in a previous post, it may be possible that a different set of unfavorable SNPs can be present in POIS sufferers, and depending on the specific set of SNPs one has, it determines the severity and exact symptoms list one shows when in POIS.   This also would account for the fact that it seems to be more than just one type of POIS.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2019, 04:37:57 PM by Bob Morane »