Author Topic: Developed POIS after antibiotic use  (Read 87467 times)

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #200 on: April 06, 2019, 09:46:12 AM »
I am sure that my current POIS like period is because of antibiotics. I used 3 kinds of antibiotics in 5 weeks. Since then I am sick. I took Fluconazol for a month but that did not help. I also stopped with eating sugar. I used a lot of prebiotics and probiotics. But I think before reparing my gut I have to get rid of a parasite. But I do not know which one. I hope that an internist can help me.

I get the POIS symptoms just from eating certain foods. There are certain vitamins that are needed for immune function, I'm currently taking Vitamin A (in active Retinol form) tablets, Vitamin D3/K2 MK-7 tablets, Gamma E Mixed Tocopherol Complex (vitamin E), Zinc Citrate, Iron and a Multi-Vitamin. So basically, I have all 4 fat-soluble vitamins (A, D, E & K), I have Zinc and Iron which are cofactors and then a multivitamin for any remaining missing nutrients.

I took Fluconazole, Canesten, Antibiotics, Prebiotics and Probiotics over the years and none of them have brought any significant improvement. I did take a regimen of vitamins and minerals with L-Arginine a couple years back and I think that gave me slow improvements, too slow for me to figure it out at the time. I am restarting this vitamin/mineral protocol and I'll try and be a bit more patient and attentive this time.

If you're going to take any fat-soluble vitamins, I think it is best to get all 4 of them at once and consider the cofactors. Vitamin A is a tricky vitamin because some people cannot convert Beta-Carotene into Retinol, therefore I am taking the active form of Vitamin A.

Avoid fish oils at all costs, these are found in cheap vitamins like Vitamin A softgels and they worsen gut issues.
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #201 on: April 09, 2019, 11:02:48 AM »
I am sure that my current POIS like period is because of antibiotics. I used 3 kinds of antibiotics in 5 weeks. Since then I am sick. I took Fluconazol for a month but that did not help. I also stopped with eating sugar. I used a lot of prebiotics and probiotics. But I think before reparing my gut I have to get rid of a parasite. But I do not know which one. I hope that an internist can help me.

I have a feeling that all of these antibiotics and other pharmaceuticals worsen chronic infections. We hear a lot about how antibiotics cause c. difficile to take over the gut in some people, I think the same has happened to me but the bacteria is different.

When I took Metronidazole, my mouth started burning for months afterwards and my face would break out in sores that looked like impetigo. I started a regimen of vitamins, minerals and garlic pills which I now think may have helped. I stopped the regimen after 30 days as I don't like taking so many supplements due to the risk of kidney and liver damage. After I stopped, I think the burning in my mouth was possibly better but then I broke out in itchy sores on my scalp which a dermatologist diagnosed as scalp folliculitis and she put me on Lymecycline antibiotics which I took for over 6 months as it's a mild antibiotic. The scalp folliculitis improved after a number of months on Lymecycline and I was eventually taken off it. I then developed white pustules on my face that would come and go, they looked exactly like the kind of spots that staph aureus bacteria cause.

After taking the Ciprofloxacin, I developed crazy symptoms so perhaps the bacteria then spread everywhere in my body or perhaps they just took over my gut and caused my immune system to malfunction. Either way, I have so many different symptoms now in every part of my body.

I said in my last post that I am resurrecting the regimen that I took to get over the Metronidazole reaction. I now wonder if Garlic pills were the reason for improving since I now know that garlic is used to treat scalp folliculitis and staph aureus. I was originally taking a supplement called "Linden's Odourless Super Garlic" which contains 6000mg of garlic equivalent, I only took 1 or 2 of these softgels capsules a day for a month.

Now, I have started taking 1 Linden's Super Garlic softgel with 1 "Allicin Max" capsule. I started these 2 garlic supplements yesterday and I had quite a difficult night with a faster heartbeat and restlessness which I hope is die-off. In the morning, my heartbeat was fine again so I'm going to continue for now. I took my garlic pills today and had a sharp pain in my scalp which could be more bacteria being killed.

I'll see how this garlic goes, too often things start out well and then end up being disappointing. If anyone wants to try garlic supplements, beware that Allicin Max has a strong garlic odour after ingesting so maybe you'd want the odourless softgels if you are going to be around people, I'm taking both for now.
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Vandemolen

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #202 on: April 10, 2019, 08:40:43 AM »
‘Recurrent antibiotic exposure is associated with increased risk for depression and anxiety but not for psychosis.’

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26580313
POIS since 2000. Very bad since 2008. I knew that I have POIS since June 2010. Desensitization since March 2011. I stopped with desens in July 2016. I have 50% less POIS. And only 1 day of POIS. Purified CBD works for me, but I am allergic for CBD.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #203 on: April 16, 2019, 12:19:41 PM »
I'm taking a break from vitamins and supplements, if they are doing anything positive then it's too gradual to notice. I'm currently testing Roquefort cheese, I have found a research article that suggests this French blue cheese (from sheep's milk) inhibits LPS (Lipopolysaccharides) inflammation. LPS is simply toxins produced by bacteria in the body (mostly the gut) that get into the bloodstream and cause havoc around the body:

Quote
Roquefort Cheese Proteins Inhibit Chlamydia pneumoniae Propagation and LPS-Induced Leukocyte Migration

Abstract
Inflammation in atherosclerosis, which could be associated with some subclinical infections such as C. pneumoniae, is one of the key factors responsible for the development of clinical complications of this disease. We report that a proprietary protein extract isolated from Roquefort cheese inhibits the propagation of C. pneumoniae in a human HL cell line in a dose-dependent manner, as revealed by the immunofluorescence analysis. These changes were accompanied by a significant reduction in the infective progeny formation over the protein extract range of 0.12–0.5??g/mL. Moreover, short term feeding of mice with Roquefort cheese (twice, 10?mg per mouse with an interval of 24 hours) led to the inhibition of the migration of peritoneal leukocytes caused by intraperitoneal injection of E. coli lipopolysaccharide. These changes were complemented by a reduction in neutrophil count and a relative increase in peritoneal macrophages, suggesting that ingestion of Roquefort could promote regenerative processes at the site of inflammation. The ability of this protein to inhibit propagation of Chlamydia infection, as well as the anti-inflammatory and proregenerative effects of Roquefort itself, may contribute to the low prevalence of cardiovascular mortality in France where consumption of fungal fermented cheeses is the highest in the world.



Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3655667/

« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 12:23:27 PM by Simon66 »
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

demografx

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #204 on: April 16, 2019, 12:31:50 PM »
Thanks, Simon.
10 years of significant POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #205 on: April 16, 2019, 12:48:54 PM »
Thanks, Simon.

You're welcome.

One quote from that research article on Roquefort cheese really stands out to me:

Quote
"There are multiple reports regarding identification of C. pneumoniae in the tissues of the cardiovascular system, joints, brain, and meninges"

A lot of POIS sufferers are chasing viruses as a potential cause of these systemic issues we have. It looks like there are chronic bacterial infections that settle in all parts of the body, Roquefort appears to be useful against C. Pneumoniae. The article also mentions that heart diseases are very low in areas of France where this cheese is popular.

For people in the USA, unfortunately this cheese is banned by the FDA due to the bacterial counts being too high, it's a very strong blue cheese. It seems to be sold on Ebay but whether it would get past customs is another question.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 12:51:48 PM by Simon66 »
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #206 on: April 16, 2019, 01:25:10 PM »
Looking back at my health history, a C. Pneumoniae infection would make sense for these reasons:

- I used to have chronic chest infections as a child (aged 4-7) during winter months, I was given amoxicillin in the form of a banana-flavoured liquid every year for a few years. My family then moved abroad to a country on the equator when I was around 7 years old and I didn't get sick any more due to the tropical climate. Aged 9, I came back to visit the UK during the school holidays and experienced pain when breathing in and out, my mother took me to a doctor who listened with a stethoscope and then suggested it was just stress though I wasn't stressed about anything and was actually enjoying my holiday although it was quite cold relative to the tropical country I was living in abroad. My family moved back to the UK a few years later and my health again started going downhill again.

- When I took Metronidazole a couple years back, I remember in the months after that I was having a really sharp stabbing pain in my right lung and also in my brain. The quote in my last post mentions that this C. Pneumoniae bacteria can invade the brain and its meningeal membranes. Pneumonia is well-known as a lung infection.

So, this is another promising avenue with some good circumstantial evidence pointing in its direction. Perhaps antibiotics allow C. Pneumoniae infections take over the body just like C. Difficile does.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 01:48:55 PM by Simon66 »
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Hopeoneday

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #207 on: April 16, 2019, 02:00:25 PM »
At my age 12-13, after tick bite, i did got severe lung infection, pneumonia on both wings because of doctors misdiagnose. I lay sick 3-4 moonth in bed taking antibiotics, since then i was sick more ofen, since then my health has never been the same.
I thing taht root couse of my pois is from there, bad genetics from mother side,
bad imunity.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 02:03:25 PM by Hopeoneday »
Dr-pois.

Nas

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #208 on: April 16, 2019, 02:13:44 PM »
At my age 12-13, after tick bite, i did got severe lung infection, pneumonia on both wings because of doctors misdiagnose. I lay sick 3-4 moonth in bed taking antibiotics, since then i was sick more ofen, since then my health has never been the same.
I thing taht root couse of my pois is from there, bad genetics from mother side,
bad imunity.
Auto-immune diseases are theorized to start from an infection causing the immune system to mis-characterize our own tissue as that same infection. Maybe that's where our journey with POIS starts. 

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #209 on: April 19, 2019, 12:40:18 PM »
I'm currently looking at supplementing Vitamin D at doses of 5000IU and above. I'll be taking Vitamins A and K1/K2 as cofactors.

Here's a research article about the function of vitamin D in maintaining the gut balance. Perhaps in some cases, POIS is a depletion of vitamin D which unbalances the gut and causes metabolic chaos including malabsorption of vitamins. People interested in Vitamin D may like to read about the "Coimbra Protocol" which is being used to treat Multiple Sclerosis.

Quote
Vitamin D Signaling through Induction of Paneth Cell Defensins Maintains Gut Microbiota and Improves Metabolic Disorders and Hepatic Steatosis in Animal Models

Abstract
Metabolic syndrome (MetS), characterized as obesity, insulin resistance, and non-alcoholic fatty liver diseases (NAFLD), is associated with vitamin D insufficiency/deficiency in epidemiological studies, while the underlying mechanism is poorly addressed. On the other hand, disorder of gut microbiota, namely dysbiosis, is known to cause MetS and NAFLD. It is also known that systemic inflammation blocks insulin signaling pathways, leading to insulin resistance and glucose intolerance, which are the driving force for hepatic steatosis. Vitamin D receptor (VDR) is highly expressed in the ileum of the small intestine, which prompted us to test a hypothesis that vitamin D signaling may determine the enterotype of gut microbiota through regulating the intestinal interface. Here, we demonstrate that high-fat-diet feeding (HFD) is necessary but not sufficient, while additional vitamin D deficiency (VDD) as a second hit is needed, to induce robust insulin resistance and fatty liver. Under the two hits (HFD+VDD), the Paneth cell-specific alpha-defensins including ?-defensin 5 (DEFA5), MMP7 which activates the pro-defensins, as well as tight junction genes, and MUC2 are all suppressed in the ileum, resulting in mucosal collapse, increased gut permeability, dysbiosis, endotoxemia, systemic inflammation which underlie insulin resistance and hepatic steatosis. Moreover, under the vitamin D deficient high fat feeding (HFD+VDD), Helicobacter hepaticus, a known murine hepatic-pathogen, is substantially amplified in the ileum, while Akkermansia muciniphila, a beneficial symbiotic, is diminished. Likewise, the VD receptor (VDR) knockout mice exhibit similar phenotypes, showing down regulation of alpha-defensins and MMP7 in the ileum, increased Helicobacter hepaticus and suppressed Akkermansia muciniphila. Remarkably, oral administration of DEFA5 restored eubiosys, showing suppression of Helicobacter hepaticus and increase of Akkermansia muciniphila in association with resolving metabolic disorders and fatty liver in the HFD+VDD mice. An in vitro analysis showed that DEFA5 peptide could directly suppress Helicobacter hepaticus. Thus, the results of this study reveal critical roles of a vitamin D/VDR axis in optimal expression of defensins and tight junction genes in support of intestinal integrity and eubiosis to suppress NAFLD and metabolic disorders.

Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5108805/
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #210 on: May 01, 2019, 02:04:57 PM »
Not had significant improvement from my vitamin A, D, K & E regimens.

Bought some milled flaxseed which seems to temporarily replenish the fat that's missing under my eyes. There is a 2 day lag between taking the flax and seeing benefits. I guess flax fights lipid peroxidation.

I'm now focusing on B vitamins. I react badly to activated or coenzyme B complexes so I have bought some nutritional yeast flakes and may get some brewer's yeast powder later. Interestingly, brewer's yeast is used by new mothers to produce more breast milk due to it's high vitamin, mineral and amino acid content. If you believe that POIS happens when semen production depletes scarce levels of bodily resources then maybe these yeasts will help us too.
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #211 on: May 05, 2019, 08:47:33 AM »
Nutritional yeast seems to rebuild the fat under my eyes even better than the flax seed. However, I've stopped the yeast for now due to some adverse effects, I don't think my immune system likes it. I've ordered some Brewer's yeast which should be less salty and perhaps better tolerated.

I've been revisiting Lactobacillus Rhamnosus GG lately. My POIS is kind of strange, I guess because my gut bacteria are seriously messed up by Ciprofloxacin. Sometimes having an O actually seems to make things better, it feels like an O shifts gut bacteria either favourably or unfavourably.

One thing I've noticed is that during an O, my underarm body odour becomes strange like the body is expelling something. I've tested a lot of probiotics but only Rhamnosus GG causes the same abnormal body odour. I've read that this strain of bacteria is very good at binding toxins and expelling them so I'll be experimenting further.
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Muon

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #212 on: May 05, 2019, 11:27:34 AM »
Sometimes having an O actually seems to make things better.
Same here. I can shift the state (whatever that means) of my body by inducing an orgasm when I feel very bad outside of POIS (it feels like it's stuck in some bad state which It can be launched out of by orgasm). I still feel bad but less so. Orgasm should be somewhat intense otherwise it will make things worse. Orgasm might be a double edged sword. My interferon gamma seems to get suppressed temporarily by orgasm, so it might suppress an inflammatory state.

One thing I've noticed is that during an O, my underarm body odour becomes strange like the body is expelling something.

Same here again. It also expells something from the skin. My optometrist diagnosed me with Blepharitis and told me these channels under the eyelids were full of lipids and that I had to squeeze them out. So when POIS hits me these channels under my eyelids are accumulated with lipids (eyes get dry as well), heat will soften these lipids up so it can be pushed out more easily. These meibomian glands are being inflamed. My skin in general gets fatty and something is being expelled from the armpit yes, perhaps these might be lipids as well. POIS might attack gland specific tissue here.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2019, 12:09:00 PM by Muon »

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #213 on: May 05, 2019, 01:46:17 PM »
Sometimes having an O actually seems to make things better.
Same here. I can shift the state (whatever that means) of my body by inducing an orgasm when I feel very bad outside of POIS (it feels like it's stuck in some bad state which It can be launched out of by orgasm). I still feel bad but less so. Orgasm should be somewhat intense otherwise it will make things worse. Orgasm might be a double edged sword. My interferon gamma seems to get suppressed temporarily by orgasm, so it might suppress an inflammatory state.

One thing I've noticed is that during an O, my underarm body odour becomes strange like the body is expelling something.

Same here again. It also expells something from the skin. My optometrist diagnosed me with Blepharitis and told me these channels under the eyelids were full of lipids and that I had to squeeze them out. So when POIS hits me these channels under my eyelids are accumulated with lipids (eyes get dry as well), heat will soften these lipids up so it can be pushed out more easily. These meibomian glands are being inflamed. My skin in general gets fatty and something is being expelled from the armpit yes, perhaps these might be lipids as well. POIS might attack gland specific tissue here.

I have a feeling if we compared our symptoms, a lot of them would match. I too have the meibomian gland dysfunction and severe dry eyes, mine developed immediately after taking the Cipro, it's quite common for people that take this form of antibiotics. Here's a link that might interest you:

http://fluoroquinolonethyroid.com/book_page/how-my-flox-symptoms-were-affected-by-th-and-iodine/painful-dry-eyes/

I wouldn't read too much into what this person is doing with thyroid hormones and iodine. Taking iodine can supposedly induce autoimmune thyroiditis so I wouldn't mess with any of this stuff.

I've found that taking certain things like a probiotic called Zenflore or a prebiotic called "short-chain FOS" will make my dry eyes much worse. If I keep a certain diet then the dry eyes subside so I pretty much eat the same meal every day and that keeps symptoms more stable. Lactobacillus Rhamnosus GG has possibly improved the dry eyes but I won't know for certain until I test it repeatedly.

At this stage, I think the most likely cause of all these metabolic and immune issues is that most of my gut bacteria were killed off by the antibiotics. I was reading an article about Rhamnosus GG today and it seems like the "Swiss Army knife" of gut bacteria, perhaps it will help cultivate some beneficial bacteria in my gut or perhaps the ecosystem damage is too great to recover. Here's the article:

https://www.clinicaleducation.org/resources/reviews/lactobacillus-gg-a-potent-immune-regulator-effective-in-many-disorders/

If FMT pills ever become commercially available in Europe, I will be one of the first customers. FMT in my opinion is currently run by arrogant cowboys who think they know everything about the gut so I think pills are some years away. Here are my issues with the current FMT practitioners:

- Most of them use enema delivery which isn't going to help the small intestine where I think a lot of the problems are. FMT PILLS WOULD SOLVE THIS ISSUE BUT MOST PRACTITIONERS THINK ENEMA IS BETTER AND REFUSE TO OFFER PILLS.
- To have FMT, patients currently have to sign a disease waiver whereby they can't sue if they catch something from the transplant. Insurers have taken an interest in FMT but have yet to provide any insurance policies as far as I know. I WOULD ACTUALLY ACCEPT THE RISK IF IT MEANT I COULD GET ON WITH MY LIFE.
- The preparation steps for enema FMT sound like they can do a lot of harm. Firstly, taking lots of magnesium and then having a colonic to "clean out the intestines". The intestines aren't meant to be clean and during a colonic, you are losing good bacteria and mucus. THIS IS THE MAIN REASON I REFUSE TO DEAL WITH THESE FMT COMPANIES, THEY SOUND LIKE ARROGANT COWBOYS. THEY AREN'T ACTUALLY CLASSED AS HEALTHCARE PRACTITIONERS AND YET THEY THINK THEY CAN JUST CLEAN OUT SOMEONE'S INTESTINES, THIS ARROGANT BEHAVIOUR WORRIES ME.
- They only test a donor's blood but don't test every sample due to the high costs. I GUESS THIS IS REASONABLE BUT I WONDER IF SOME DONORS ARE ABUSING THE SYSTEM AND GIVING SAMPLES FROM THEIR DISEASED FRIENDS IN ORDER TO EARN EXTRA MONEY.
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Muon

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #214 on: May 05, 2019, 03:00:22 PM »
I'm not convinced it's the gut, it might be. Sometimes my brain reacts to food, like chocolate for example, it feels heavy (kicks in after ~60 min). It depends on the amount. I'm not sure about any cause discussed here on this forum to be honest. I feel like I'm boxing against a man wearing night vision goggles in a pitch dark room.

''or perhaps the ecosystem damage is too great to recover.''
Yes this is a scenario that is in the back of my mind.

I'm also tired of all these claims from clinical cowboys advertising their products.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2019, 03:27:17 PM by Muon »

Nas

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #215 on: May 05, 2019, 03:40:55 PM »
I feel like I'm boxing against a man wearing night vision goggles in a pitch dark room.

Same, I know a doctor from Egypt who has POIS, he's also completely clueless of what may cause POIS.
Currently I'm just hanging on a small thread of facts that I know aren't disputed. All are leading to immune dysfunction. I don't know how the neuro-symptoms are related. But all I know, is that after ejaculation my penis and groin region become on fire, and that dexamethason which is an immune-suppressant is the only thing that worked out for me. I also know that the neuro-symptoms are not neuro-inflammation related; i.e. not COX related since NSAID's are completely useless and not histamine related since anti-histamines are also completely useless. Based on that there is a connection between neuro-symptoms and the immune reaction that needs to be understood in order to even know how to deal with it.

Muon

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #216 on: May 05, 2019, 03:59:39 PM »
I had once groin (lies in dutch) problems and had a hard time standing on my leg. The doctor gave me an intramuscular injection with steroids once close to that spot. The problem was fixed for 4 hours. I could even run if I wanted. I can't remember the steroid he used. You said you were in contact with a belgian doc as well. Do they use this forum as in are they active on this forum?
« Last Edit: May 05, 2019, 04:01:53 PM by Muon »

Nas

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #217 on: May 05, 2019, 04:08:29 PM »
I had once groin (lies in dutch) problems and had a hard time standing on my leg. The doctor gave me an intramuscular injection with steroids once close to that spot. The problem was fixed for 4 hours. I could even run if I wanted. I can't remember the steroid he used. You said you were in contact with a belgian doc as well. Do they use this forum as in are they active on this forum?
No, they both know about this forum but they don't seem like they like to engage in it; they seem to favor Facebook more. To be fair FB is much more user friendly than this forum and it seems hard to convince them to jump into this forum, even though this forum is closer to the research world. I'll talk with the Egyptian and see if he likes to give this forum a go.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #218 on: May 18, 2019, 06:23:40 PM »
I've made a lot of progress with my health over the last 2 weeks. I've been doing quite a few things so it's difficult to pin down what exactly brought about the improvements. Here's a list of the things I've been doing:

1) I am eating Babybel cheese (the original red, full fat variety). I was taking Thorne Vitamin K2 MK4 a month ago and perhaps that's why I can now tolerate cheese without getting bone spurs in my fingers or perhaps a probiotic shifted my gut bacteria and increased vitamin K production by my resident gut bacteria.
2) Probiotic 1 - B. Lactis BB12. I use an American brand called Align Daily Immune Support which I think may have now been discontinued.
3) Probiotic 2 - L. Rhamnosus GG (also known as LGG). I use a Polish product called "4 Lacti", it's in the form of liquid drops.
4) Probiotic 3 - L Acidophilus Unknown Strain. I use a product called "Lindens Pro Billion Daily".
5) I am eating dried Goji Berries. I use a product called Linwoods whole sun-dried goji berries.
6) I am now eating other forms of cheese, apparently they boost short chain fatty acids in the gut, which is good for inflammation. I don't do so well with cheeses that are grown with mould such as Brie, Camembert and Blue cheese but they may be beneficial still.
7) I'm also now eating a lot of white basmati rice.

The improvement I've had is that I can tolerate eating a lot more foods now without having scary symptoms appear.

With the probiotics, I tend to tolerate the BB12 better than the LGG or Acidophilus. After taking the Acidophilus, I woke up the next day coughing up a large amount of phlegm like I was suffering from a heavy flu. I've had this reaction previously with a B. Longum probiotic called BB536, I think it's a positive reaction, possibly my immune system eradicating some yeast like candida or perhaps a chronic Staph Aureus infection.

Even the BB12 produced symptoms initially. The first day I took it, I had a hard time getting to sleep that night, I had heart palpitations and just felt restless. Now, I don't have any issues with it. The Lactobacillus Rhamnosus GG gave me some abnormal body odour, possibly like my body was purging some toxins and I had some spots appear on my skin a couple days later.

I like the combination of B. Lactis, L. Acidophilus and L. Rhamnosus (Rhamnosus needs to be the GG strain). I've bought some new products like "Solgar Advanced Multi-Billion Dophilus" which is a complex that contains 3 powerful probiotic strains i.e. BB12, LA-5 and LGG. I've also bought some probiotics from a company called Optibac that contain combinations of B. Lactis and L. Acidophilus, they are called "Everyday Extra Strength" and "Everyday Max".

I've given up taking any supplements aside from the probiotics and seem to be better off. So, varied food and probiotics are working for me lately.
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.

Simon66

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Re: Developed POIS after antibiotic use
« Reply #219 on: May 19, 2019, 06:24:03 AM »
Found an interesting research article that says B. Lactis BB12 and L. Rhamnosus GG have a synergetic effect when supplemented at exactly the same time. If they are taken at different times of the day then no significant synergy is found.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1046/j.1472-765x.2000.00590.x
Disclaimer: Please research all supplements thoroughly and take them at your own risk. I am not responsible for any adverse reaction you may suffer.

Avoid all Fluoroquinolone antibiotics including Ciprofloxacin, Levaquin and Avelox.