Author Topic: Long time sufferer  (Read 3328 times)

crmfghtr

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Long time sufferer
« on: February 04, 2018, 12:00:30 PM »
I have been fighting this, if it is POIS for over 20 years.  My symptoms are now all just like yours(early stages were just brain fog for years)  except I dont notice them in minutes or hours after orgasm.  Sometimes no effect until the next day or even 2 days later, does this make any sense?  I was a police officer for 22 years and after doctors could find nothing wrong(except a very high ANA level over and over) was forced to retire due to dizzyness, debilitating fatigue and tinnitus.  My symptoms always intensify after sleep.  The reason I came here was a chinese doctor diagnosed me with this.  She told me to refrain from sex with my wife for at least two weeks.  It seemed to work but next time we had sex waited two weeks again and nothing, still wiped out.  I do have an abnormally high sex drive.  It was very difficult to go two weeks without and since it didnt seem to help last time not really sure its worth it just makes me twice as irritable!  Any thoughts are welcome but this is only place I found all same symptoms as me, burning red eyes, fatigue, brain fog etc.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2018, 12:15:26 PM by crmfghtr »

Observer

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2018, 01:21:28 PM »
I have been fighting this, if it is POIS for over 20 years.  My symptoms are now all just like yours(early stages were just brain fog for years)  except I dont notice them in minutes or hours after orgasm.  Sometimes no effect until the next day or even 2 days later, does this make any sense?  I was a police officer for 22 years and after doctors could find nothing wrong(except a very high ANA level over and over) was forced to retire due to dizzyness, debilitating fatigue and tinnitus.  My symptoms always intensify after sleep.  The reason I came here was a chinese doctor diagnosed me with this.  She told me to refrain from sex with my wife for at least two weeks.  It seemed to work but next time we had sex waited two weeks again and nothing, still wiped out.  I do have an abnormally high sex drive.  It was very difficult to go two weeks without and since it didnt seem to help last time not really sure its worth it just makes me twice as irritable!  Any thoughts are welcome but this is only place I found all same symptoms as me, burning red eyes, fatigue, brain fog etc.

Hello crmfghtr,

Welcome to our forum!

I would say that your case is not the most common one. According to Dr. Waldinger's studio, 87% of POIS sufferers say that their complains start within the first 30 minutes after an Orgasm. However, I recall seeing cases of people who said that their symptoms appeared in the following 24-48 hours... It seems that you are one of those cases.

Did this chinese doctor get in touch with other POIS sufferers? I think it could be interesting to have him in our database of collaborators.

In this forum you can see some remedies that have been found to be effective in dealing with POIS symptoms. I would suggest that you read about nanna and Quantum's stacks (Quantum has also a good thread about nutrition), Going Less Crazy's dietary approach or the thread about niacin. There are also other members who have tried other approachs with a significant amount of success.

I am one of the members that has had huge success with  niacin. After 6 years taking it (moderately I have to say) I can say that it still works and prevents my POIS symptoms from developing (mostly cognitive) after an Orgasm (with the unfortunate exception of some digestive issues that don't normally last more than 24 hours).

I hope you can find relief here and alleviate the awful symptoms!

Quantum

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2018, 01:46:54 PM »
Hi crmfghtr, and welcome to the forum!

High ANA would be consistent with an auto-immune problem, and POIS is more and more seen as such, in particual by Dr Waldinger, who was the first doctor to write about POIS, and who created the "Post-Orgasmic Illness Syndrome" (POIS) name.

Auto-immune problem can have a delayed onset.  My symptoms appear between 2 to 6 hours after release. This is due to the time it takes for the cascade of immune events to take place, to finally end at those events which directly cause the symptoms.

As Observer says, you are only part of those who have a longer delay before symptoms appear, but I think that what you described is indeed POIS.
You are 100% responsible for what you do with anything I post on this forum and of any consequence it could have for you.  Forum rule: ""Do not use POISCenter as a substitute for, or to give, medical advice" Read the remaining part at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=1.msg10259#msg10259

crmfghtr

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2018, 09:01:55 PM »
Thanks, I guess I will force myself to give it another shot, wont be fun but perhaps she was right.   The chinese doctor did not describe it in terms like you do here, being an auto immune response in body to semen etc but more in chinese terms of the body and depleting life essence etc.  She also prescribed a herb, deer antler velvet which did seem to help some but it also increases your sex drive, double edged sword.  Another one was zizyphus to calm body.  For about a week after that and the two weeks of abstinence I was in heaven.  But as I said it didnt last and doing it all over again for 2 weeks didnt do anything so I gave up.  Lots to read here and very helpful, super intelligent people that have done extensive research.  I did try every route in medical science, my own doctor sent me to Mayo, they just said sorry chronic fatigue syndrome, cant help you!  Even though I told them it couldnt be as only had brain fog, stuffy nose etc for years before fatigue.

crmfghtr

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2018, 09:11:28 PM »
I found this on internet, describes the chinese version of this better then I described. I have to admit, it does seem odd she nailed this issue and I come here and find all of you describing the same symptoms.

This topic is not broadly discussed, but You may certainly find many resources in the internet about that. Many men who masturbate observe many degenerative health problems but don't know what is the reason. I would like to write more about this topic from the perspective of Traditional Chinese Medicine - medicine that is over 5000 years old (compared to less than 100 years contemporary medicine).

At first I would like to point that for a man every ejaculation has bad effect on their health. Usually masturbation is worse, because people do it more and it forms habit, but the main factor is frequency. Every man after ejaculation feels severe fatigue and sleepiness. The more frequency, the more he feels it and more time is required to recover (if someone does it once per month you may not notice). But most of them don't know why.
For years of masturbation (usually one per day for 12 years) my overall health was getting worse and worse. I suffered from adrenal fatigue syndrome, I had low immunity (throat infections 10 times per year), eye floaters, gastric problems, indigestion, headaches and many many more. I spend tons of cash and time to diagnose what's wrong. From the medicinal perspective nothing was wrong. I just had "low immunity" and a few "syndromes" (like AFS, IBS, .....). But why??? I was born healthy with good genes and had much energy during childhood. I would have saved much money, health and time if I knew something I will write in this post.

What contemporary medicine has to say about masturbation and ejaculation?
Do it more, it is healthy, normal, do it whenever you want! Sex and masturbation is healthy, you will have less risk of heart attack, etc.
What says TCM (Traditional chinese medicine)?
Man is build from many different vital substances:
http://www.sacredlotus.com/theory/substances/jing.cfm
Most precious of them is Jing. It is the essence of all vitality of human. Part of it is inherited from parents (DNA) and the rest is aquired from very slow process of refinement of digesting food and breathing air. It is the most concentrated vital substance which is crucial for all living processes. All other substances, like blood, marrow, brain tissue or bones have their source in jing. Jing is stored in kidneys. To form one drop of blood it is necessary to digest about 20 times more food. To form one drop of jing about 40-50 drops of blood is required. Although energy which controls the vital processes (qi) and form thoughts (shen) comes from transformation of jing.
Guess what is the main ingredient of semen? Exactly - Jing. It has the power to bring life. But what gives life, that takes life. Each ejaculation depletes man of tons of vitality. Frequent ejaculations lead to jing deficiency. What are the effects?
Of course premature aging effects and other diseases:
http://www.sacredlotus.com/diagnosis/patterns/patterns_ki.cfm#jing

Jing is the source of all yin and yang in man. It nourishes blood, marrow, brain, eyes, ears, it is required for digestion (and thus consuming new energy). Depleting jing leads to premature aging, hair graying, teeth problems, tinnitus, bone malformations, mental fog, bad concentration and many symptoms related to specific organs.

http://www.jostsauer.com/2009/01/come-again-ejaculation-affairs-and-yin-and-yang/
http://www.sacredlotus.com/theory/illness/other_causes.cfm#sex

Quantum

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2018, 07:54:19 AM »
Hi crm,

TCM theory and treatments have been discussed, and probably tried, by POIS sufferers.  Unfortunately, to date, no member here reported he has found relief through TCM.

If too much sex or masturbation were to main causes of POIS, there would be millions of cases worldwide and this syndrome wouldn't be a rare syndrome, in my opinion.  So, clearly, to me, there are some very specific "requirements", be they genetic, metabolic, or else, in order to develop POIS.

I agree with you that deer velvet antler is not the best to use in POIS, because boosting libido is tricky for us.  This product has a good potential to help with inflammation, but there are many others that are also good at that, and that do not boost libido.  Reducing the frequency of sex activity is part of what helps us get a better quality of life, so, personally, I stay away from ginseng, maca, tribulus, and anything that would push me the other way.

However, you can take a look at this chart : http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2338.msg19448#msg19448 .  You will find there a list of method that brings relief to POIS sufferers.  There is no known cure yet, but there are different methods to relieve symptoms.  those listed have been proven to at least one member to relieve at least 80% of symptoms, for at least 2 to 3 months ( proving that it is not only placebo effect, which fades after a short time).  From this chart, you will deduct that it seems that there are many types of POIS, because no one method is efficient for every POIS sufferers - what is beneficial for one may not be for others.  We all share a common trigger and a common pattern, but the exact inner events may differ from one another.

Do not hesitate to ask questions about any of these methods.



« Last Edit: February 05, 2018, 07:44:29 PM by Quantum »
You are 100% responsible for what you do with anything I post on this forum and of any consequence it could have for you.  Forum rule: ""Do not use POISCenter as a substitute for, or to give, medical advice" Read the remaining part at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=1.msg10259#msg10259

certainlypois2

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2018, 12:45:20 PM »
I have been fighting this, if it is POIS for over 20 years.  My symptoms are now all just like yours(early stages were just brain fog for years)  except I dont notice them in minutes or hours after orgasm.  Sometimes no effect until the next day or even 2 days later, does this make any sense?  I was a police officer for 22 years and after doctors could find nothing wrong(except a very high ANA level over and over) was forced to retire due to dizzyness, debilitating fatigue and tinnitus.  My symptoms always intensify after sleep.  The reason I came here was a chinese doctor diagnosed me with this.  She told me to refrain from sex with my wife for at least two weeks.  It seemed to work but next time we had sex waited two weeks again and nothing, still wiped out.  I do have an abnormally high sex drive.  It was very difficult to go two weeks without and since it didnt seem to help last time not really sure its worth it just makes me twice as irritable!  Any thoughts are welcome but this is only place I found all same symptoms as me, burning red eyes, fatigue, brain fog etc.
You say your pois is intensified by sleep, i have never heard of that, virtually everybody says sleep helps.
can you elaborate more, does all your symptoms worsen, and do your symptoms increasingly get worse as the week goes.
The only thing i can compare it to is when i initially wake up i can really feel that fatigue but when i finally get up and start doing things the fatigue feels less.  also nights that i have sex dreams without ejaculation my symptoms worsen.
also do you

Vandemolen

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2018, 01:03:04 PM »
I have been fighting this, if it is POIS for over 20 years.  My symptoms are now all just like yours(early stages were just brain fog for years)  except I dont notice them in minutes or hours after orgasm.  Sometimes no effect until the next day or even 2 days later, does this make any sense?  I was a police officer for 22 years and after doctors could find nothing wrong(except a very high ANA level over and over) was forced to retire due to dizzyness, debilitating fatigue and tinnitus.  My symptoms always intensify after sleep.  The reason I came here was a chinese doctor diagnosed me with this.  She told me to refrain from sex with my wife for at least two weeks.  It seemed to work but next time we had sex waited two weeks again and nothing, still wiped out.  I do have an abnormally high sex drive.  It was very difficult to go two weeks without and since it didnt seem to help last time not really sure its worth it just makes me twice as irritable!  Any thoughts are welcome but this is only place I found all same symptoms as me, burning red eyes, fatigue, brain fog etc.
You say your pois is intensified by sleep, i have never heard of that, virtually everybody says sleep helps.
can you elaborate more, does all your symptoms worsen, and do your symptoms increasingly get worse as the week goes.
The only thing i can compare it to is when i initially wake up i can really feel that fatigue but when i finally get up and start doing things the fatigue feels less.  also nights that i have sex dreams without ejaculation my symptoms worsen.
also do you
It’s not the sleep. But it’s the period after the O. When I have an O. in the morning my POIS that day is not very bad. But until the next morning it gets worse. When I O. at night the next morning my POIS is bad. I think because when in POIS your sleep is worse. Maybe your body can’t get in a deep sleep. But if on day 1 of POiS I take a nap in the afternoon I feel better afterwards. POIS has a period of about 15 hours to take in. Just like a virus. When you got the influenza virus it takes a week before you get sick.
POIS since 2000. Very bad since 2008. I knew that I have POIS since June 2010. Desensitization since March 2011. I stopped with desens in July 2016. I have 50% less POIS. And only 1 day of POIS. Purified CBD works for me, but I am allergic for CBD.

crmfghtr

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2018, 10:38:23 PM »
Hi crm,

TCM theory and treatments have been discussed, and probably tried, by POIS sufferers.  Unfortunately, to date, no member here reported he has found relief through TCM.

If too much sex or masturbation were to main causes of POIS, there would be millions of cases worldwide and this syndrome wouldn't be a rare syndrome, in my opinion.  So, clearly, to me, there are some very specific "requirements", be they genetic, metabolic, or else, in order to develop POIS.

I agree with you that deer velvet antler is not the best to use in POIS, because boosting libido is tricky for us.  This product has a good potential to help with inflammation, but there are many others that are also good at that, and that do not boost libido.  Reducing the frequency of sex activity is part of what helps us get a better quality of life, so, personally, I stay away from ginseng, maca, tribulus, and anything that would push me the other way.

However, you can take a look at this chart : http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2338.msg19448#msg19448 .  You will find there a list of method that brings relief to POIS sufferers.  There is no known cure yet, but there are different methods to relieve symptoms.  those listed have been proven to at least one member to relieve at least 80% of symptoms, for at least 2 to 3 months ( proving that it is not only placebo effect, which fades after a short time).  From this chart, you will deduct that it seems that there are many types of POIS, because no one method is efficient for every POIS sufferers - what is beneficial for one may not be for others.  We all share a common trigger and a common pattern, but the exact inner events may differ from one another.

Do not hesitate to ask questions about any of these methods.

Thanks yes you are right ha, be many men walking around like zombies!  Thanks for this link a lot to look over

crmfghtr

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2018, 10:41:08 PM »
I have been fighting this, if it is POIS for over 20 years.  My symptoms are now all just like yours(early stages were just brain fog for years)  except I dont notice them in minutes or hours after orgasm.  Sometimes no effect until the next day or even 2 days later, does this make any sense?  I was a police officer for 22 years and after doctors could find nothing wrong(except a very high ANA level over and over) was forced to retire due to dizzyness, debilitating fatigue and tinnitus.  My symptoms always intensify after sleep.  The reason I came here was a chinese doctor diagnosed me with this.  She told me to refrain from sex with my wife for at least two weeks.  It seemed to work but next time we had sex waited two weeks again and nothing, still wiped out.  I do have an abnormally high sex drive.  It was very difficult to go two weeks without and since it didnt seem to help last time not really sure its worth it just makes me twice as irritable!  Any thoughts are welcome but this is only place I found all same symptoms as me, burning red eyes, fatigue, brain fog etc.
You say your pois is intensified by sleep, i have never heard of that, virtually everybody says sleep helps.
can you elaborate more, does all your symptoms worsen, and do your symptoms increasingly get worse as the week goes.
The only thing i can compare it to is when i initially wake up i can really feel that fatigue but when i finally get up and start doing things the fatigue feels less.  also nights that i have sex dreams without ejaculation my symptoms worsen.
also do you
Yes thats me all the way, terrible when wake up but better as day goes on.  And yes again, the symptoms get increasingly worse as week goes!!  Exercise sometimes helps also if not too far gone

crmfghtr

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Re: Long time sufferer
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2018, 10:43:53 PM »

[/quote]
It’s not the sleep. But it’s the period after the O. When I have an O. in the morning my POIS that day is not very bad. But until the next morning it gets worse. When I O. at night the next morning my POIS is bad. I think because when in POIS your sleep is worse. Maybe your body can’t get in a deep sleep. But if on day 1 of POiS I take a nap in the afternoon I feel better afterwards. POIS has a period of about 15 hours to take in. Just like a virus. When you got the influenza virus it takes a week before you get sick.
[/quote]

I did have multiple sleep studies so I believe you are right, I had very little delta/deep sleep, I feel this is biggest cause of my fatigue.  Never thought about it that way, about a virus taking a bit before your body really feels hit