Xanthiol Nicotinate - Benefits, Risks and Function in POIS

[Daveman]

Xanthiol Nicotinate is a form of niacin (Vitamin B3) which is a vasodilator used in peripheral vascular disorders and insufficiency.  Also has been used (in pill form as niacin) to treat short-term memory disorders, lack of concentration, attention and vigilance (works possibly because it dilates constricted cerebral vessels).

So maybe it helps with symptoms of this condition if vasoconstriction occurs after sex. For whatever reason, it's also used by body builders.
** it should be taken with caution since in high doses may cause liver problems and severe hypotension.

...... but IM route is a dangerous route--very direct, bypasses stomach, therefore puting it more into the range similar to "high doses" above.

Anyone taking BP meds should use with caution due to the tendancy that would exist for exageration of the hypotension tendancy. Obviously anyone with liver problems would also have to use caution.


Xanthiol Nicotinate does seem to have some potential for at least reducing POIS symptoms.

In this topic we should discuss Xanthiol Nicotinate, it's pros and cons, it's legality, people's experience with it, etc. I would like to see if there is any information that can lead to more serious investigation as part of our ongoing research.

[Animus]

I am highly suspicious because:

This person is suddenly coming out of nowhere with no context suggesting this.
I have seen elaborate Russian scams before over the internet.
There is no explanation of why this works, and why it helps POIS.
The person who introduced it wants to sell it to us- this is the clearest indication of a scam.


Let's let the initial euphoria die down, and see if this has staying power. sorry to be skeptical!
thanks.

[Habibou]

I think we should forget about Dmitry (oh, as soon I wrote this name, I forgot it  ), and try to understand why it worked !
And if possible, get more information about the suffers who got "cured" with that.

The cognitive effect is proved. I talked about it with my doctor who told me :
-It was a real double(Xanthinol+Nicotinate) effect vasodilator.
-The nicotinate is found in cigarettes and really help to focus on things (one of the only benefit to smoke...never did that) since it helps more glucose and O2 coming into the brain cells.
-Never take a vasodilator if you get heart disorder/operation
-Intramuscular Injections are more efficient than the digestive way and reaches a maximum 100 minutes after injection (it is true what we heard so)


I think that IF XN works, then the POIS  is for a part :
 only an over cerebral vessels constriction which lasts from the O (arousal for some) until some time  (the POIS recovery).

It would mean that our brain takes a very long time to relax the constricted cerebral vessels. Thus, our brain gets less (perhaps a very small difference) O2 and glucose than before. With the time, the vessels get relaxed and we go back to the normal with O2 and glucose income

My theory would be for the "cognitive" symptoms :
brain fog/memory loss/ ability to focus       +         ears blowing/locked nose and throat/feeling the heartbeat in the brain (pressure due to constricted vessels), and so on...

I am 90% cognitive POIS, I had NO semen allergy , nor positive immune reaction tests due to the O. That is why I build up my own theory (based on the potential XN) which could fit into my case (cognitive) !

[Daveman]

I wonder if there is any nicotine addiction?

Brain fog for those effected cognitively comes on after about 24 hrs (more strongly) and lasts for several days, in some weeks? I don't imagine that the cereberal vessels are contricted all that time, or if they are, it would be as a result of some external influence like inflamation, meaning infection, allergy or auto-immune, or hormonal.

If I understood "an explanation" given is that the vasodilation prevents this inflamation causing event from happening. Now that would be cool if it were true. Not only is it compatible with auto-immune as proposed by Dr, Waldinger, but is this medication stops POIS from starting.

If "they" pursue this theory, we will have to insist in scientific proof, written and approved by some peer group. OR proceed to do it ourselves.

o, if TN reduces symptoms simply by openning the cereberal vessels, it isn't really a cure, although still would be quite welcome. However if it isn;t a cure we would need to dig deeper and find out the origin of the inflamation od cerebral vessels.


Habibou, I am not too sure still about your test results meaning that you do not have semen allergy. Could you post the results here? Were you tested for type IV reactions at least 2 days after the orgasm for instance? Did you test for semen with sperm, or just semen....

It would be good to have the results so we can better understand the inflamation factor in the brain.

[B_Daniel]

Daveman, I like that you're keeping such an open mind through this whole process.  It's like every day someone comes up with a completely new theory on POIS and we all jump on the bandwagon of desperateness!  That being said, I think it's judicious to track every lead.  Recently I have begun to notice that sometimes I will have an O that will cause 9+ days of POIS.  Then other days I have an O and my POIS is greatly reduced within 18 hrs and gone a couple days later.  I've heard other people have similar experiences.  If that's true, it doesn't fully support the auto-immune hypothesis in my opinion - although i don't know enough about allergies to say that resolutely.  Ugh  - sometimes I think we'd be better off trying to Cure Global Warning or the traffic problem in New York City!

[Habibou]

Daveman, this is the only abnormalities (red colour) I got from my blood tests in immunology !

November                                         June (O 10 hours before + O 3 days before)

-Ig M =      249%                        260%               (of the normal avergave)
-Ig G =       99%                            90%
-Ig A =       49%                           60%            
-Ig E =      190%
   C3 =      124%                            98%
   C4 =        73%                           42%[/td][/tr][/table]


                                     January
-adrenaline           <0.50 nmol/l         < 1.00
-noradrenaline        8.53 nmol/l       < 4.00                              1443 ng/l      < 675
-dopamine            <0.50 nmol/l         <1.00


Unrina :

-adrenaline       0.02 umol/l           < 0.10
-noradrenaline   0.42 umol/l          < 0.50
-dopamine        1.34 umol/l           < 3.00

All the blood tests were done 2 hours after an O.
The red standards are the unusual ones !

Last blood tests abnormal standards (with an 2 "O" 12 and 10 hours before + O 3 days before)
                                                   June
TGMH                           33.3 pg        (27.0 - 32.0)
VMP                              10.3 fl          (6.0 - 10.0)
Reticulocytes                 30 giga/l        (50 - 100)
Phosphatase alkalines    128 U/l         (37 - 111)
Cholesterol                    4.04 mmol/l   (4.40 - 6.45)
Albumin                        48.6 g/l        (38.0 - 46.0)

[victor.kons]

OK, I'm here guys, if you have any questions about my experience with XN I'm ready to answer

Victor

[Habibou]

Hei Victor,

Many questions about it :
When did you try XN? What did you try before XN success for you?
What were your symptoms, exactly? (more cognitive? physic? = could you describe them in details please!)
Do you feel free of symptoms or not totally?
How many suffers you know got a success with that?
Did you have some blood tests in immunology/hormonally + brain MRI? which ones? what were the results?

Good work ! ^^ thank you !

[Daveman]

Habibou,

I'd say these tests indicate that you DO have an auto-immune reaction. Your IgE is 190% 10 hours after orgasm. This is definitely type I, and just as Dr. Waldinger predicts.

I'm not familiar with the others, but with so much abnormality, it has to indicate domething. Hoepfully we can get someone more knowledgable to interpret these, someone who knows how to interpret them in relation to POIS that is.

It's not that I want to go crazy in support of the auto-immune theory, but it is very important to see why we have cerebral vessel inflamation, and/or other inflamation, becasue although XN might make us feel better, we need to know if it is just solving the symptoms or attacking the cause.

And if it's just solving the symptoms, knowing how and what these are guides us in understanding the process and eventually one would hope, finding a cure.

[victor.kons]

Hi, Habibou!

Hei Victor,

Many questions about it :
When did you try XN?

I tried XN one year ago, on summer 2010. It was not really me who experimented, it was my therapist who experimented, she tried different drugs for stimulating the brain activity, because due to my tests I had starting edema of a brain. I don't know the correct english names for this drugs and right now have no time to lookup, writing from the airport, these drugs were: cerebrolisin, piracetam, glukosa, niacin, cavinton. She treated me against edema, but I complained about my disease and after I came to her after a sex, each time she had a hard time to bring me to normal state, she had a problems with making me a dropper, because in POIS my heart start to go crazy and my blood pressure reacted unusually to drugs, e.g. it started to drop very fast after taking medicines, whereas in normal state it was stable. So she had to find some cure to help me overcome POIS symptoms, so that she would be able to treat my edema. So it was like a technical task for her. The situation was bad also because I had problems with my stomach and she were unable to use niacin, because it is not good for a stomach, so she decided to change the medicine to equivalent, e.g. to XN. And, one time when she suffered again with me, she recommended me to inject myself XN, before I will have a sex and go for a dropper, and since that time I experimented with XN and found minimal doze for myself, which works for me.

I inject 0.5ml of XN once a day, if I'm going to have a sex this day. Timing doesn't really matter I can inject XN just before sex, I can inject it 3 hours before, it will work, and it works pretty long, I think for 5 hours at least. But it should be injected only before sex, if injected after sex it won't help at all, it will be useless

What did you try before XN success for you?

I had POIS since my first O, I was 14 years old boy when I started to feel these terrible symptoms. At first it was only brain fog which disturbed me. To prevent brain fog I had learned poems and texts by heart, after O, and it helped to quickly neutralize POIS symptoms, but over time I needed to study longer and longer texts and around the age of 22 it stopped working for me completely and I've started to attend various doctors. I had a terrible experience with doctors, I went through the road of unbeliveable pain and misery. My only wish was to diagnoze the disease, but I didn't succeded in that. I've failed, tried again and then failed even more, feeling terrible frustration.

After that I've left the comment on the medical consultation forum about this disease, which didn't helped me really but through which I started to find the people with the same disease and one day we with the guy MaxComp decided to have a russian blog about POIS, we really didn't know at that time the name POIS, we called it Syndrom-X. After some time MaxComp became religious person and he said that what we are doing is not right, I didn't understand why, but he left and I'm currently the admin on this blog.

What were your symptoms, exactly? (more cognitive? physic? = could you describe them in details please!)

My symptoms was started as cognitive only, but after the age of 22 I think I started to feel terrible physic symptoms too. I felt aches in the various parts of my body while in POIS, I noticed that I have face edema, my heart was going crazy. I used to run in the morning, I very very like to run, but I noticed that while in POIS if I run, I had terrible symptoms  after that, e.g. they become worser. I also have cognitive symptoms - brain fog, idiotic thinking, depression,  loss of memory, aggression. The last time I had this symptoms they have lasted for 3 days.

Do you feel free of symptoms or not totally?

If I do injection I feel that I'm an absolutely NORMAL person, e.g. I have no POIS symptoms that disturb me, no brain for at all, I can sit and drive the car after sex, without fears. But I do feel that I had a sex, e.g. I feel that its different after sex, I feel maybe that I'm a bit tired, but I don't feel something bad, its all very light.

But right now, you know, I'm almost forget that I have POIS, I feel myself normal person... One always want a better life, but current my life is much more trouble less, the troubles that normal person has is nothing compared to that of POIS-ers.

How many suffers you know got a success with that?

I'm for sure remember 3 sufferers, but maybe I don't remember someone, I shouted to the syndrom-x blog at Friday, but didn't got a reply from anyone yet.

Did you have some blood tests in immunology/hormonally + brain MRI? which ones? what were the results?

Yes, I have such tests. But right now I'm writing from the airport and have no tests with me, I will find these tests and post the results as soon as I will land.

Good work ! ^^ thank you !

You are absolutely welcome. We are all in the same boat.

Victor

[Habibou]

Victor, thank you very much for this comprehensive answer !  we all learnt a lot from your story !

I'd say these tests indicate that you DO have an autoimmune reaction. Your IgE is 190% 10 hours after orgasm. This is definitely type I, and just as Dr. Waldinger predicts.

Thank you Daveman ! 
The IgE test had been made 2 hours after an O , in November 2010 (but at this time, we found out a lactose intolerance, so i don't know what is the cause of those high IgE. Since this date, i didn't check !
I should ask or add it on the prescription...

I agree with you Daveman : many standards from Ig A/M/E which are not in the normal and still my doctor said antihistamine would be enough...
Anyways, i sent it to another doctor who spends time on me since he is friend from family, i am looking forward to hear his view !

[Ccconfucius]

what sideeffects did your doctor tell you to watch out for using xanithol nicotinate

how do you spell xanithol nicotinate in russian  i think i found a legitimate ukrainian pharmacy that is willing to ship around the world and take major currencies
pharmalad.com
what do you guys think.

[demografx]

My 2 cents worth :-)

XN seems to be very B3 related (Niacin), and my DR after much talking of my condition had stated that I should try taking B3. There are 2 kinds, one will make you very flush and one will not, he said to find the non-flush type.....

I had read someone talking about the Niacin and 5 hour energy giving someone an allergic reaction, this was not allergies, this is what the one form of Niacin does....

Anyway thought it was an interesting coincidence.

I am going to start taking my B3 and see....

PS.

mod edit - Niacin bold-enlarged-emphasis above is mine, demo

Holy Moly! After re-reading POIS-SUFFERER's post above, it suddenly hit me: my POIS has strangely but dramatically improved recently - 90% to 100% POIS relief, over my usual 80% relief with testosterone replacement therapy (TRT)...

At the same time, I also was recently put on NIASPAN® (niacin extended-release tablets) for my cholesterol!

I hope this is real and not just a happy interlude!

Stay tuned!

Wow.

I was warned of a "flushing" side effect, and was advised to take uncoated 325 mg. aspirin 30 minutes before taking the NIASPAN®, for the first few days so the body gets accustomed to it. I was told that many people quit this niacin therapy because of the flushing and possibly other adverse side-effects. Following my physician's directions, I tolerate it very well.

This is NOT a recommendation for you to try it, though I really hope this helps the forum's research! And - as always - work closely with your physician, and keep in mind that we are all different! What works for one person might not work for someone else. And could even be harmful.

[victor.kons]

Hi, Ccconfucius

what sideeffects did your doctor tell you to watch out for using xanithol nicotinate

My doctor told me to read XN instruction for sideeffects and that I shouldn't scary of Niacin Flush when I take XN. But in reality for me flush was very minor and I quickly adapted to niacin, so I don't have visible redness on the skin after taking XN now. You can obviously search over internet about XN sideeffects and instruction in english.

how do you spell xanithol nicotinate in russian  i think i found a legitimate ukrainian pharmacy that is willing to ship around the world and take major currencies
pharmalad.com
what do you guys think.

I spell it "ksantinola nikotinat". I don't know French, unfortunately. And I don't know any credible internet pharmacies.... So really I can't help you here, sorry, google and healthy skeptics are your friends in the search for pharmacy.

Victor

[victor.kons]

Holy Moly! After re-reading POIS-SUFFERER's post above, it suddenly hit me: my POIS has strangely but dramatically improved recently - 90% to 100% POIS relief, over my usual 80% relief with testosterone replacement therapy (TRT)...

At the same time, I also was recently put on NIASPAN® (niacin extended-release tablets) for my cholesterol!

I hope this is real and not just a happy interlude!

Stay tuned!

Wow.

This is NOT a recommendation for you to try it, though I really hope this helps the forum's research! And - as always - work closely with your physician, and keep in mind that we are all different! What works for one person might not work for someone else. And could even be harmful.

Demo, I like to think that this is the B3 which helps, this would made things easy for many of you, because you don't have XN easily available, but I can't be sure until someone really tries niacin and XN and says that they have the same positive effect for him...

Victor

[victor.kons]

I have a reply to my shout "who tried XN". I will translate these replies and post them here.

One person "gabin" writes that he tried niacin acid in pills in doses 200-250mg at a time, it didn't have any effect on POIS symptoms for him, he writes that he didn't tried injections.

Victor

[Starsky]

Is Niacin a compound of semen?

[Starsky]

"Fenugreek contains high concentrations of choline, tryptophan, ascorbic acid, niacin and potassium."

[Bulls eye]

Hello victor , my symptoms are very much like yours , am currently 23 ,my symptoms started at my first onset of puberty and was strictly cognitive at that time , it was devastating for me because my IQ was my only asset at school , i'm very happy for you that you found stability and knew how to control pois , wish you all the best

I'm having trouble finding XN injections where I live , but there is ceberolysin trade name is cerebrolysin , did it work for you ?

[victor.kons]

Hi Bulls eye,

Hello victor , my symptoms are very much like yours , am currently 23 ,my symptoms started at my first onset of puberty and was strictly cognitive at that time , it was devastating for me because my IQ was my only asset at school , i'm very happy for you that you found stability and knew how to control pois , wish you all the best

I'm having trouble finding XN injections where I live , but there is ceberolysin trade name is cerebrolysin , did it work for you ?

No, cerebrolysin didn't help with POIS for me at all

Victor