Author Topic: Official Desensitization plan Begins!  (Read 120400 times)

Ccconfucius

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #270 on: May 22, 2013, 11:47:10 PM »
Hello...

I gave up this treatment.

I found no advance in nearly 18 months. Nothing, absolutely nothing.
I won't go again just to pay for a treatment that just makes me feel sick, giving me a kind of "voluntary" POIS.
I'm tired... I'm sorry guys. This is not working for me and I shall try to live with this nightmare.
You can reach me in my e-mail i case you need information or something else.
Regards,

JP
sorry it did not work for you. you should try other remedies that have helped others one might just help you  a lot.

poiseidon

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #271 on: May 24, 2013, 02:13:38 AM »
you made me feel good with your words stef. i just hope you re right too..

bless
After spending loads on supplements I found out that the only thing that works is abstinence. Full stop. And it's free.
Meditation if done correctly is great too.
Also avoiding computers produce faster recoveries and fewer temptations.

Clycos

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #272 on: May 24, 2013, 03:00:15 PM »
This is great news thank you stef!!

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #273 on: June 05, 2013, 07:20:02 PM »
Hello...

I gave up this [desensitization] treatment.

I found no advance in nearly 18 months. Nothing, absolutely nothing.
I won't go again just to pay for a treatment that just makes me feel sick, giving me a kind of "voluntary" POIS.
I'm tired... I'm sorry guys. This is not working for me and I shall try to live with this nightmare.
You can reach me in my e-mail i case you need information or something else.
Regards,

JP


JP, I am very sorry to hear this. Please don't give up, we WILL find  Y  O  U  R  solution!!!
« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 07:27:43 PM by demografx »
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

jotape_chile

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #274 on: June 06, 2013, 12:38:02 PM »
Dear friends... thanks a lot for your support.
I do not feel sorry for myself because of the failure in my treatment.
Clearly some accomplishments were reached: Semen inyections caused me POIS, which makes me think this could really be an allergy (or else, who knows). But some relationship exists.

Unfortunately I did not experience any relief in 1,5 years. This procedure cost me dearly: the strong POIS I had the day of the procedure and the day after affected my performance in my job, and many times I could not even go. I was fired last april.
I will give a try to Niacin again... worked for me once, but not a second time.

I thank you all the support, and will continue posting here. Again: if anyone wants to contact me, you can e-mail me :-)
Best regards, we will find a cure.

JP

Vandemolen

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #275 on: June 10, 2013, 05:13:06 PM »
Sorry to hear that JP. I hope you will find a new job and a treatment where you can find some relief. Yes you should try Niacin again. You never know. Good luck!
POIS since 2000. Very bad since 2008. I knew that I have POIS since June 2010. Desensitization since March 2011. I stopped with desens in July 2016. I have 70% less POIS. And only 1 day of POIS. Purified CBD works for me, but I am allergic for CBD.

demografx

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Re: The Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #276 on: June 12, 2013, 02:05:09 PM »
By the way you can say prick prick prick here!



But do I have to say pen.is? ;D

<ducking>
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #277 on: June 13, 2013, 07:31:43 PM »
[Posted by new forum member, "yasienhossam", representing medical researchers who sign this posted letter. Posted Letter addressed to Dr. Marcel Waldinger]

Dear Prof Waldinger,

It has given us great honor when the editors of F1000 Research had told us that you will be one of the reviewers of our paper but we were astonished when we read your response which  said that you refused  our work that was accepted (with reservation) by the other 3 referees.  We think and feel that it was not fair enough.
 Actually we respect your own opinion but we are surprised!; how it comes to reject a case report of POIS (the rare disease) and say that you encourage publication in that topic?!. Is it related to  what you think that; the idea of atopy may be a precipitating factor for POIS  is yours and not ours ?!.  We think that this is not true. This is because we discovered our case by the end of 2009 and at that time you have only one publication in 2002- in which you didn't refer at all to atopy. We have found that our patient is atopic and in addition to the cognitive  and body pains he feels post orgasmic; his atopy flares  up  eye irritation with severe body itching. By December 2009 and after preparing the report and before its publication we sent you 3 e-mails with about one week intervals,  by the full length paper to ask you your experience as the only reporter of this syndrome - at that time -  but sadly enough we didn't receive any reply.  Please, return back to your archive. Moreover;  in 2010; we shared the ISSM forum by this case report  also before you mention at all any relation of POIS to atopy -  you mentioned it only in your publication at 2011 -  and many of our colleagues who are ISSM members  shared by comments and discussion ; we remember that one of them was Prof. David Goldmeier. Please go back to the ISSM Forum 2010. This case report was presented  as a poster in the 20th World Congress for Sexual Health, held in June 12- 16, 2011, Glasgow, UK  , and published in its  proceedings . For the before mentioned reasons we think that; it is ours and not yours that; atopy may be a precipitating factor for POIS and we must ask about and check for it in any of POIS cases.
Our Dear Dr  Waldinger, in your reply one of the reasons for which you refused our case report -as you stated - is that we mentioned that; NSAIDs, tramadol and SSRIs may help and you didn't find any response to these drugs. We want to remind you that this is not our findings  but the references mentioned and our patient didn?t get any benefit from trying these drugs;  please you can read our case report again !.
What we feel very important and we want to discuss is the skin prick test as a diagnostic test for allergy. Do you think that it is a reliable one in this regard?  is it  enough to reach the final conclusion that POIS patients are allergic to their own semen and that this is the cause of POIS?. Basically; we know -  and it is scientifically proved -  that this test  has many false positive and negative results. Moreover; we as andrologists ; knew - and it is scientifically proved as well that; our semen is foreign for our body and our  immune system.  Immunologic tolerance to it  is not present as it formed only after our puberty where the immune system didn't identify it in utero. For this reason our God totally separated it from our immune system by what is well known now as the very competent Blood  Testis barrier that is formed by the highly efficient Sertoli Sertoli cell junctional complex.  It is not - as you mentioned on you tube - a hypothetical membrane. Only in certain known pathologic conditions this barrier may be broken. If occurred we form auto-antibodies against our semen. So; when we inject our own semen intradermaly we will react positively to it  as it is a foreign antigen for us. Please try to apply this very simple prick test for you and your assistants using your own semen; mostly you will get a positive reaction without having POIS. Moreover; if we suppose that;  allergy to the patient's  own semen is the cause of POIS; it was mandatory to measure serum and seminal plasma anti-sperm antibodies; IgA, IgG and IgM, to do immuno bead and MAR testing and to report on the patient's seminogram changes as in such cases ? if this is true -  POIS patients will  be mostly infertile as well. So; as you depended only upon the unreliable  skin prick test  and for the afore mentioned scientific facts,  we  - and we think that we will be shared by anyone who is interested in andrology -    think that; your conclusion is not right and we can't scientifically accept  that the cause of POIS is allergy to own semen.  
Dear Prof, we are surprised; how it comes that; only from two patients ? without placebo control ? wants us to accept that; hyposensitization using the patient's own semen is the treatment of POIS!.  Although your last two papers are published in a highly respectable journal we are sorry to say that; this is not right from the scientific facts mentioned above and they are only two patients. We think that; any benefit  if any is not more than placebo.
 
Thanks,   
Prof. Dr Abdalla attia & Dr  Hossam Yasien
Andrology Unit,
Faculty of Medicine,
Minoufiya University,
Egypt

 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

yasienhossam, thank you for your excellent questioning!

I hope Dr. Waldinger will respond.

Best regards,
Demo

ps - contact info

Prof. dr. Marcel D. Waldinger
dr.m.d.waldinger@gmail.com




[The above was edited from the original below. Edits mostly include  "?" for ' and in some cases ? were removed. My apology if I inadvertently altered any original meaning by the author - demo]


Dear Prof Waldinger,
It has given us great honor when the editors of F1000 Research had told us that you will be one of the reviewers of our paper but we were astonished when we read your response which  said that you refused  our work that was accepted (with reservation) by the other 3 refrees.  We think and feel that it was not fare enough.
 Actually we respect your own opinion but we are surprised!; how it comes to reject a case report of POIS (the rare disease) and say that you encourage publication in that topic?!. Is it related to  what you think that; the idea of atopy may be a precipitating factor for POIS  is yours and not ours ?!.  We think that this is not true. This is because we discovered our case by the end of 2009 and at that time you have only one publication ?  2002- in which you didn?t refer at all to atopy. We have found that our patient is atopic and in addition to the cognitive  and body pains he feels post orgasmic; his atopy flares  up  ?  eye irritation with severe body itching. By December 2009 and after preparing the report and before its publication we send you 3 e-mails with about one week intervals,  by the full length paper to ask you your experience? as the only reporter of this syndrome - at that time -  but sadly enough we didn?t receive any reply.  Please, return back to your archive. Moreover;  in 2010; we shared the ISSM forum by this case report ? also before you mention at all any relation of POIS to atopy -  you mentioned it only in your publication at 2011 -  and many of our colleagues who are ISSM members  shared by comments and discussion ; we remember that one of them was Prof. David Goldmeier. Please go back to the ISSM Forum 2010. This case report was presented  as a poster in the 20th World Congress for Sexual Health, held in June 12- 16, 2011, Glasgow, UK  , and published in its  proceedings . For the before mentioned reasons we think that; it is ours and not yours that; atopy may be a precipitating factor for POIS and we must ask about and check for it in any of POIS cases.
Our Dear Dr  Waldinger, in your reply one of the reasons for which you refused our case report -as you stated - is that we mentioned that; NSAIDs, tramadol and SSRIs may help and you didn?t find any response to these drugs. We want to remind you that this is not our findings  but the references mentioned and our patient didn?t get any benefit from trying these drugs;  please you can read our case report again !.
What we feel very important and we want to discuss is the skin prick test as a diagnostic test for allergy. Do you think that it is a reliable one in this regard?  is it  enough to reach the final conclusion that POIS patients are allergic to their own semen and that this is the cause of POIS?. Basically; we know -  and it is scientifically proved -  that this test  has many false positive and negative results. Moreover; we as andrologists ; knew - and it is scientifically proved as well ?that; our semen is foreign for our body and our  immune system.  Immunologic tolerance to it  is not present as it formed only after our puberty where the immune system didn?t identify it in utero. For this reason our God totally separated it from our immune system by what is well known now as the very competent Blood ? Testis barrier that is formed by the highly efficient Sertoli ? Sertoli cell junctional complex.  It is not - as you mentioned on you tube - a hypothetical membrane. Only in certain known pathologic conditions this barrier may be broken. If occurred we form auto-antibodies against our semen. So; when we inject our own semen intradermaly we will react positively to it  as it is a foreign antigen for us. Please try to apply this very simple prick test for you and your assistants using your own semen; mostly you will get a positive reaction without having POIS. Moreover; if we suppose that;  allergy to the patient?s  own semen is the cause of POIS; it was mandatory to measure serum and seminal plasma anti-sperm antibodies; IgA, IgG and IgM, to do immuno bead and MAR testing and to report on the patint?s seminogram changes as in such cases ? if this is true -  POIS patients will  be mostly infertile as well. So; as you depended only upon the unreliable  skin prick test  and for the afore mentioned scientific facts,  we  - and we think that we will be shared by anyone who is interested in andrology -    think that; your conclusion is not right and we can?t scientifically accept  that the cause of POIS is allergy to own semen.  
Dear Prof, we are surprised; how it comes that; only from two patients ? without placebo control ? wants us to accept that; hyposensitization using the patient?s own semen is the treatment of POIS?!.  Although your last two papers are published in a highly respectable journal we are sorry to say that; this is not right from the scientific facts mentioned above and they are only two patients. We think that; any benefit ? if any ? is not more than placebo.
 
Thanks,   
Prof. Dr Abdalla attia & Dr  Hossam Yasien
Andrology Unit,
Faculty of Medicine,
Minoufiya University,
Egypt
« Last Edit: June 14, 2013, 05:20:43 AM by demografx »
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #278 on: June 14, 2013, 10:57:28 AM »
[Posted by new forum member, "yasienhossam", representing medical researchers who sign this posted letter. Posted Letter addressed to Dr. Marcel Waldinger]

Dear Prof Waldinger,

It has given us great honor when the editors of F1000 Research had told us that you will be one of the reviewers of our paper but we were astonished when we read your response which  said that you refused  our work that was accepted (with reservation) by the other 3 referees.  We think and feel that it was not fair enough.
 Actually we respect your own opinion but we are surprised!; how it comes to reject a case report of POIS (the rare disease) and say that you encourage publication in that topic?!. Is it related to  what you think that; the idea of atopy may be a precipitating factor for POIS  is yours and not ours ?!.  We think that this is not true. This is because we discovered our case by the end of 2009 and at that time you have only one publication in 2002- in which you didn't refer at all to atopy. We have found that our patient is atopic and in addition to the cognitive  and body pains he feels post orgasmic; his atopy flares  up  eye irritation with severe body itching. By December 2009 and after preparing the report and before its publication we sent you 3 e-mails with about one week intervals,  by the full length paper to ask you your experience as the only reporter of this syndrome - at that time -  but sadly enough we didn't receive any reply.  Please, return back to your archive. Moreover;  in 2010; we shared the ISSM forum by this case report  also before you mention at all any relation of POIS to atopy -  you mentioned it only in your publication at 2011 -  and many of our colleagues who are ISSM members  shared by comments and discussion ; we remember that one of them was Prof. David Goldmeier. Please go back to the ISSM Forum 2010. This case report was presented  as a poster in the 20th World Congress for Sexual Health, held in June 12- 16, 2011, Glasgow, UK  , and published in its  proceedings . For the before mentioned reasons we think that; it is ours and not yours that; atopy may be a precipitating factor for POIS and we must ask about and check for it in any of POIS cases.
Our Dear Dr  Waldinger, in your reply one of the reasons for which you refused our case report -as you stated - is that we mentioned that; NSAIDs, tramadol and SSRIs may help and you didn't find any response to these drugs. We want to remind you that this is not our findings  but the references mentioned and our patient didn?t get any benefit from trying these drugs;  please you can read our case report again !.
What we feel very important and we want to discuss is the skin prick test as a diagnostic test for allergy. Do you think that it is a reliable one in this regard?  is it  enough to reach the final conclusion that POIS patients are allergic to their own semen and that this is the cause of POIS?. Basically; we know -  and it is scientifically proved -  that this test  has many false positive and negative results. Moreover; we as andrologists ; knew - and it is scientifically proved as well that; our semen is foreign for our body and our  immune system.  Immunologic tolerance to it  is not present as it formed only after our puberty where the immune system didn't identify it in utero. For this reason our God totally separated it from our immune system by what is well known now as the very competent Blood  Testis barrier that is formed by the highly efficient Sertoli Sertoli cell junctional complex.  It is not - as you mentioned on you tube - a hypothetical membrane. Only in certain known pathologic conditions this barrier may be broken. If occurred we form auto-antibodies against our semen. So; when we inject our own semen intradermaly we will react positively to it  as it is a foreign antigen for us. Please try to apply this very simple prick test for you and your assistants using your own semen; mostly you will get a positive reaction without having POIS. Moreover; if we suppose that;  allergy to the patient's  own semen is the cause of POIS; it was mandatory to measure serum and seminal plasma anti-sperm antibodies; IgA, IgG and IgM, to do immuno bead and MAR testing and to report on the patient's seminogram changes as in such cases ? if this is true -  POIS patients will  be mostly infertile as well. So; as you depended only upon the unreliable  skin prick test  and for the afore mentioned scientific facts,  we  - and we think that we will be shared by anyone who is interested in andrology -    think that; your conclusion is not right and we can't scientifically accept  that the cause of POIS is allergy to own semen.  
Dear Prof, we are surprised; how it comes that; only from two patients ? without placebo control ? wants us to accept that; hyposensitization using the patient's own semen is the treatment of POIS!.  Although your last two papers are published in a highly respectable journal we are sorry to say that; this is not right from the scientific facts mentioned above and they are only two patients. We think that; any benefit  if any is not more than placebo.
 
Thanks,   
Prof. Dr Abdalla attia & Dr  Hossam Yasien
Andrology Unit,
Faculty of Medicine,
Minoufiya University,
Egypt

 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

yasienhossam, thank you for your excellent questioning!

I hope Waldinger will respond.

Best regards,
Demo

ps - contact info

Prof. dr. Marcel D. Waldinger
dr.m.d.waldinger@gmail.com




Dear Drs. Attia and Yasein,

I was just advised by demografx of your post.

Please apply for the POIS grant!!!  We'll give you an extension on the deadline.

Here's a link to the application:   http://tinyurl.com/bwhbn5k

FYI, we did send Dr. Attia the POIS RFP when it was first posted, because we had seen Dr. Attia's poster presentation from a conference that took place about one or two years ago.  Perhaps we had an incorrect email address for Dr. Attia.

Stefanie Putkowski, RN
NORD Research Program Administrator
research@rarediseases.org
« Last Edit: June 14, 2013, 11:07:56 AM by demografx »
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #279 on: June 14, 2013, 11:19:16 AM »
This is the article that was NOT approved, i.e., (rejected) by Waldinger, according to the letter from Egypt:
http://f1000research.com/articles/2-113/v1
« Last Edit: June 14, 2013, 03:38:05 PM by demografx »
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

b_jim

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #280 on: June 16, 2013, 01:21:17 AM »
Wow, experts quarrel :)

Quote
This is because we discovered our case by the end of 2009 and at that time you have only one publication ?  2002- in which you didn?t refer at all to atopy.

True, but in private messages and emails, Dr Waldinger suggested the hypotesis of immune system, first time in 2005 for me. In my first post, the press article ""Tired and sweaty after sex ?"was not modified and the orginal article was wrote in 2006-2007.


Anyway this new study is brilliant, thanks dr Attia, Yasien and Al-Ziny. Since the start of naked scientist Pois forum, we instinctively felt there are different forms of Pois, linked or not. And that's why our Pois Forum Center has different categories "Hormonal" "Auto-immune".
« Last Edit: June 16, 2013, 06:13:38 AM by b_jim »
Taurine = Anti-Pois

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #281 on: June 16, 2013, 02:03:49 AM »
b_jim, if you would like to see these doctors apply to our 2013 POIS RFP:
http://tinyurl.com/bwhbn5k
please feel free to send an email to them all (   to Drs. Attia, Yasien and Al-Ziny)  via yasienhossam@yahoo.com Include the preceding link , and then ask them to please apply for an extension of our Grant deadline -- the doctors should send the request to
Stefanie Putkowski
POIS - NORD Program Administrator
rn@rarediseases.org

Thanks for all your commentary, b_jim, since 2007!


« Last Edit: June 16, 2013, 10:28:48 AM by demografx »
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #282 on: June 16, 2013, 10:17:34 AM »








Help! b_jim, I couldn't resist stealing your icon!! Don't have me arrested for theft!  ;D
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

demografx

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #283 on: June 16, 2013, 10:19:23 AM »
b_jim: "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" -- old saying applies here!

Demo :)
Usually have major POIS-reduction, treatment consisting of daily (365 days/year) testosterone patches.

TRT must be checked out carefully with your doctor due to fertility, cardiac and other risks associated with it.

40+ years of severe 4-days-POIS, married, raised a family, started/ran a business.

poiseidon

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Re: Official Desensitization plan Begins!
« Reply #284 on: June 16, 2013, 10:46:16 AM »
There you go. A non-copyrighted version:)
After spending loads on supplements I found out that the only thing that works is abstinence. Full stop. And it's free.
Meditation if done correctly is great too.
Also avoiding computers produce faster recoveries and fewer temptations.