Is just thinking enough?

[certainlypois2]

Hi. I really don?t know if I have POIS, but receltly I had a flu like symtoms that go away after 2-5 days. I feel so tired after ejaculation. But this has been hapening recently. I noticed because my ejaculations have reduced to 2 o 3 in a month and I became more sensitive. I think Im gonna be more aware about symtomps because this is a new concept for me. Im not worried about POIS since I practice tantric sex, where ejaculation is not the point. I have usualy prolonged sex without ejaculation...2 o 3 times in a week, and I ejaculate one time each 8 or 10 days. Sometimes 15 to 21 days. I had 3 ejaculations en the last week because Im on vacations...and the weakness and flu symptoms appeared. Maybe this is a coincidendence....maybe not.
Thing Is...you can try tantric sex guys. It is very pleasurable...for you and your partner. Sex without ejaculation better than abstinence or drugs. long Dry orgasms (energetics) instead ejaculatory instant pleasure.
I feel curious about POIS....yes. But my practice  makes me feel calm and happy. Because I stopped basing my pleasure on ejaculation long ago. Even my wife enjoys a lot. Sure, I ejaculate even, but less and less and that does not relate the symptoms or that are more mild.

Welcome, the symptoms and recovery time sounds like pois. I will personally be worried about retrograde ejaculation or nocturnal emissions from tantric sex .

[mellivora]

If I am having sex for me it is better to ejaculate. Otherwise my symptoms will be 50% worse. Post orgasmic is a wrong term. When there is precum there is POIS. I thought there are members who have this. But there are POIS-patients who only get sick after tge ejaculation.

Same for me. Prolonged stimulation/precum leads to POIS symptoms.

[dizzy]

For me stimulation alone is bad. However stimulation + O where pleasure is suppressed seems good. By that I mean that during O I think about something else (e.g. work), and try not to enjoy the orgasm and just let the fluids ooze out. That way I don't get a headache directly after O, and if I had to guess the mechanism intuitively, I would say that somehow no vasoconstriction takes place if I O like that.

[Nas]

I'm pretty sure at this point that the substance that we are auto-immunogenic towards is one that is produced only during arousal. It might explain the pre-cum symptoms people suffer from. This auto-immune reaction is apparently producing a number of cytokines that are causing the POIS symptoms that we suffer from, most notably brain symptoms. These cytokines appear to be auto-immune specific, or in other term POIS specific, which can explain why normal flu for example or wound infection does not cause POIS symptoms. If we can isolate which substances are produced by sexual glands, specifically during orgasm we can identify what we are auto-immunogenic towards.

[demografx]

Not for me. If no ejaculation, no symptoms too.

b_jim, that’s exactly it for me as well.

[swell]

I like your explanation with certain reservations.  What if (and I think that maybe the case) our internal skin tissue - mucus membranes are highly sensitive, inflamed due to certain abnormality.  A normal mucus membrane would not produce the kind of allergic reaction to ejaculate that an impaired mucus membrane produces?. 

Fyi:  I also do not produce POIS symptoms with pre-cum.  Pardon my impaired memory, I read in some research publication (and that may be pertinent).  It was something like that a certain % of men in their pre-cum can leak sperm/dead sperm (or something like that), while most male dont.

I'm pretty sure at this point that the substance that we are auto-immunogenic towards is one that is produced only during arousal. It might explain the pre-cum symptoms people suffer from. This auto-immune reaction is apparently producing a number of cytokines that are causing the POIS symptoms that we suffer from, most notably brain symptoms. These cytokines appear to be auto-immune specific, or in other term POIS specific, which can explain why normal flu for example or wound infection does not cause POIS symptoms. If we can isolate which substances are produced by sexual glands, specifically during orgasm we can identify what we are auto-immunogenic towards.

[OpiesDad]

I am strongly in the arousal alone (no hard on, touching, pre-cum, just thoughts alone) can produce symptoms in me, most specifically a buzzy, light headedness that lasts for hours.  For example on Sunday I am perusing Instagram and it turns some good looking people I follow are porn stars.  This excited me. Run a search, watch a video and the very act of watching for 30 seconds made me feel like my bell was rung and it lasted for hours.  So weird and this is what life has been like for me for the last 6-8 months but NOT before.  I am 40 y/o.

[Nas]

Same, it sucks.

[demografx]

Very interesting! I’ve always been fascinated with oxytocin. (But it can have serious harmful side effects).

Just to clarify: by the above, I meant taking synthetic Rx oxytocin, e.g., Pitocin. I wasn’t referring to what the body naturally produces in arousal/sex/orgasm

(In my above response to hurray & BoneBroth).

More info on oxytocin:
https://tinyurl.com/y46dr7ww

[Eliasjoelrivera]

Well I get very obvious POIS symptoms only by "thinking". Just the smallest thought could ruin hours or a day. I remember a time when I could not even hold my GF's hand while walking in the park. Intrestingly when that happened I used to get a tense feeling in the testes that lasted for hours if not a day. That does not happen now. The sensitivity comes and go. But the symptoms are diffrent then on O. If ranking them in order of severity this would be the list:

Worst (1) to mildest (5):

1. NE: 7 days of headache-hell and tonnes of other symptoms.
2. MB: About the same symptoms but maybe 20% milder. I dont remember really, long time ago, but quite serious.
3. Sex with O. Varying severness. If hight stimulation/arousal and long duration, it gets worse. If much body contact and little stimulation/arousal and shorter duration it gets less. Often 7 days of hell, but occationally just a day. The degree of severness varies greatly.
4. Sex without O. I read somewhare that this would be the sollution. Maybe 40% better than nr 3 on the list. This POIS involve more hot flashes then the O ones. In a best case scenario the symptom is gone the next evening.
5. Erotic thoughts. Headache and hot flash. Duration depends on the length of the thought. An easy though triggered by something seened on TV/magazine (for just a second) could results in 10 minutes symtoms. Deeper toughts could ruin a whole night, mainly because the hot flashes and nightmares that comes with it. That night a NE is more likely to happen.

Does anyone else experience it in the same way? I believe the diffrence in severity between O with or witout body-contact has to do with the release of the antiinflammatory hormone oxytocin that balances the inflammatories. The diffrence with O and non-O has to do with the quantity of hormones beeing released. On O, there is a tsunami of hormones beeing released that takes a giant effort to clean up from the blood stream. Why this has such an evil impact is the million dollar question. Maybe poor blood circulation, maybe bad liver detox function, maybe bad blood vessels, maybe receptors that are beeing over-stimulated, maybe too many receptors, maybe to much release of hormones.

how are you!!. My case is exactly similar to yours. It was progressive. just thinking about a sexual thought wakes up mini pois and produces some inflammation and free cortisol release in the body.
Therefore, I could say that there is a psychosomative component in the users of pois ... although the trigger is physical, the symptoms are real and occur at a chemical level. The root could be psychic, I affirm it because in my case I was diagnosed with anxiety disorder, as a boy I had many problems with nervous tic. I could say that Pois has a paicosomatic component that recharges our nervous system ... it would be like a kind of stress.
Somehow our nervous system is overloaded. there should be a section where we tell our awakening of pois. when it started. Let us remember which was the trigger. In my case I developed it at age 14 ... but I remember having a tic nervous boy, being very guilty, anxious. in short, some psychological component must exist .... since I have many friends who masturbated much more than me and did not develop it. Many men who practiced sex more than me and do not develop it. Although we handle electric volts when treating all sexuality, the psychological factor must affect in some way. We would have to investigate.

[BoneBroth]

Thanks for your story Eliasjoelrivera! I believe that stress and anxiousness do play an important factor in developing POIS. But it all comes down to hormones. Although cortisol is the major stress hormone, we should not blame it for causing POIS. As stress progressens the adrenals (who make cortisol) work overtime, secreting and storing cortisol.

In the earlier stages of stress the cortisol levels increase and so does other hormones that are secreeted at the same time from the adrenals to balance cortiols catabolic effects (DHEA, aldosterone). Common problems in this stage is dry and oily skin (excess sebum because of exceess cortisol) and acne, hair loss and hot flashes.

When adrenals wear out the anabolic hormones gets low before cortisol does (because cortisol is so important to stay alive - you will die in 48 hours if you don't get enought cortisol). Cortisol production is still hight. This means weakened muscles and strength beause of lack of anabolic hormones.

Finally cortisol storage also get low so you don't produce enough to control the inflammation that is caused by the POIS. What exacly causes the POIS I don't know, but probably a hormone that is released during orgasm (prolactin maybe?). Cortisol/DHEA/aldesterone are suppose to take care of this inflammation unless enough of oxytocin is beeing released, which of cause is the case when there is body-contact. So in this perspective the sollution to POIS is:

1. Less stress (rebuild the adrenals). Meditate, walk in the nature, swimming, sun, vacation (many get relief of POIS during vacation).
2. Stimulate anabolic hormones like testosterone by exercise and do weight lifting (and supplement with zink, ashwaghanda, maca and magnesium etcetera).
3. Just have normal sex, don't masterbate and avoid nocturnal emissions by not watching porn and turn of the TV/smartphone/computer two hours before bedtime.
4. Stimulate cortisol by beeing out in the sunlight at least 30 minutes a day, take vitamin C, acetylcarnitine, licorice and avoid cortisols negative catabolic effects by eating a diet with hight protein and low carbohydrate. Just eat meat and vegetables/green sallads with some fat sauce. Don't eat potatoes/rice/pasta/bread/sweets/wheat).
5. Take lots of Omega 3 (at least two tablespoons a day) to combat inflammation and stimulate the flow of sebum in the follicles. Also try ginger and curcumin.

This is helping me. Specially the Omega 3 and vitamin C (about 2000-4000 mg/dag).