Significant POIS Reductions from Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride Tablets

[wolf]

 I have been having a Significant POIS Reductions from taking sleeping aids after an O named Sleep.eze  which are Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride Tablets, they are over the counter sleep aids. I feel much better when I wake up, but, it is making me wake up really late, luckily for me my job starts in the afternoon. It hasn't fully relieved my symptoms but I have been feeling better both physically and mentally.

I urge some of you guys to try this and give back some feedback on this. I do believe there is something in these tablets that reduces POIS symptoms.

[demografx]

Sounds like the main ingredient in Benadryl, wolf. It helps me get to sleep better (and with far fewer side effects) than prescription sleep aids. It's a histamine-blocker.

Maybe the allergy reduction of DMT works for you in combating your POIS? I know that I often sneeze at POIS onset.


 

[Quantum]

I have been having a Significant POIS Reductions from taking sleeping aids after an O named Sleep.eze  which are Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride Tablets, they are over the counter sleep aids. I feel much better when I wake up, but, it is making me wake up really late, luckily for me my job starts in the afternoon. It hasn't fully relieved my symptoms but I have been feeling better both physically and mentally.

I urge some of you guys to try this and give back some feedback on this. I do believe there is something in these tablets that reduces POIS symptoms.

Hi Wolf, 

Thanks for sharing your successful relief method.   We have some members who have also reported good results with antihistamine  ( they are often used in sleep-aid pills because they cause drowsiness, but what you take is the same as Benadryl, Demo is absolutely right).

You can see at http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2310.msg19222#msg19222 , that Happy2, has also very good results with antihistamines.   Nico and Certainlypois2 are also reference members for success with antihistamines, in my POIS Types Chart ( see http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2338.msg19448#msg19448 , Antihistamine Type ).   

If you have consistent success for at least 2 or 3 months with antihistamines, and want to be added as a reference member in the chart, just let me know

[wolf]

ok, so I understand that it contains antihistamines. Demo, yes it sure does help me sleep as well, especially after an O that is when I find it really hard to get sleep and I'm glad to hear that it has helped you reduce your POIS too. And yes Quantum, you can me as a reference member in the chart, I have tried many things but the sleep-aid has so far been working out best for me.

[nanna1]

Hi wolf,

  Benadryl (Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride) is a known cause of dementia and increases risk of Alzheimer's disease. This is because it is a strong anticholinergic which blocks acetylcholine receptors [1], resulting in a progressive loss of higher level cognitive function and memory. The following article summarizes the relevant research nicely:
Common-Anticholinergic-Drugs-Like-Benadryl-Linked-Increased-Dementia-Risk

  If you skip down to the paragraph titled "What should you do?", it gives a brief solution with a link to the Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden (ACB) scale [2]. The ACB scale gives a rating to every antihistamine (and other anticholinergics) based upon how much cognitive impairment and memory loss they cause. A score of (1-to-3) effectively means (not bad-to-very bad) effect on the brain. Allegra (Fexofenadine) is the safest antihistamine, but it won't help your sleep, and has no effect on the brain.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphenhydramine#Mechanism_of_action
2. Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden Scale, Indiana University School of Medicine (2008) ACB_scale_-_legal_size.pdf

[fathom]

So Fexofenadine if taken before o, will minimize 'inflammation'? which in turn causes POIS (and while not harming cognition).
Please correct my logic, I'm lame on this stuff, but trying to learn.

Hi wolf,

  Benadryl (Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride) is a known cause of dementia and increases risk of Alzheimer's disease. This is because it is a strong anticholinergic which blocks acetylcholine receptors [1], resulting in a progressive loss of higher level cognitive function and memory. The following article summarizes the relevant research nicely:
Common-Anticholinergic-Drugs-Like-Benadryl-Linked-Increased-Dementia-Risk

  If you skip down to the paragraph titled "What should you do?", it gives a brief solution with a link to the Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden (ACB) scale [2]. The ACB scale gives a rating to every antihistamine (and other anticholinergics) based upon how much cognitive impairment and memory loss they cause. A score of (1-to-3) effectively means (not bad-to-very bad) effect on the brain. Allegra (Fexofenadine) is the safest antihistamine, but it won't help your sleep, and has no effect on the brain.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphenhydramine#Mechanism_of_action
2. Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden Scale, Indiana University School of Medicine (2008) ACB_scale_-_legal_size.pdf

[nanna1]

Hi fathom,

Yes, Allegra/Fexofenadine inhibits histamine-related allergies and inflammation. It is a 2nd generation antihistamine that blocks H1-histamine receptors. An explanation for how H1 receptors could affect POIS is found in the first post here.

[wolf]

Thanks, nana, this is very usefull information we must always look at the long term side-effects when experimenting with treatments, I have taken Benadryl but did not get the same relief as to when I took the sleep-eze tablets which do contain the same stuff. I will try out Allegra and see how it works out for me.

[certainlypois2]

Hi wolf,

  Benadryl (Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride) is a known cause of dementia and increases risk of Alzheimer's disease. This is because it is a strong anticholinergic which blocks acetylcholine receptors [1], resulting in a progressive loss of higher level cognitive function and memory. The following article summarizes the relevant research nicely:
Common-Anticholinergic-Drugs-Like-Benadryl-Linked-Increased-Dementia-Risk

  If you skip down to the paragraph titled "What should you do?", it gives a brief solution with a link to the Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden (ACB) scale [2]. The ACB scale gives a rating to every antihistamine (and other anticholinergics) based upon how much cognitive impairment and memory loss they cause. A score of (1-to-3) effectively means (not bad-to-very bad) effect on the brain. Allegra (Fexofenadine) is the safest antihistamine, but it won't help your sleep, and has no effect on the brain.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphenhydramine#Mechanism_of_action
2. Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden Scale, Indiana University School of Medicine (2008) ACB_scale_-_legal_size.pdf

Antihistamines ate the best remedy i have found yet, but after a week of using them daily i start to get memory problems. I get stuck on trying to remeber what something is called way often.
good link

[Quantum]

Hi wolf,

  Benadryl (Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride) is a known cause of dementia and increases risk of Alzheimer's disease. This is because it is a strong anticholinergic which blocks acetylcholine receptors [1], resulting in a progressive loss of higher level cognitive function and memory. The following article summarizes the relevant research nicely:
Common-Anticholinergic-Drugs-Like-Benadryl-Linked-Increased-Dementia-Risk

  If you skip down to the paragraph titled "What should you do?", it gives a brief solution with a link to the Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden (ACB) scale [2]. The ACB scale gives a rating to every antihistamine (and other anticholinergics) based upon how much cognitive impairment and memory loss they cause. A score of (1-to-3) effectively means (not bad-to-very bad) effect on the brain. Allegra (Fexofenadine) is the safest antihistamine, but it won't help your sleep, and has no effect on the brain.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphenhydramine#Mechanism_of_action
2. Anticholinergic Cognitive Burden Scale, Indiana University School of Medicine (2008) ACB_scale_-_legal_size.pdf

Antihistamines ate the best remedy i have found yet, but after a week of using them daily i start to get memory problems. I get stuck on trying to remeber what something is called way often.
good link

Thanks Nanna for the important warning ( even if this is an OTC drug in most countries!), it has to be considered on the long run for sure, and thanks for sharing your experience with this drug, Certainlypois.


I don't use Benadryl/diphenhydramine against my POIS.   I had been given it as a child for my hay fever, and have always hated its effect on me - I was feeling completely phased out, with a heavy drowsiness.  Maybe like those who have brain fog when in POIS... so no point for me to take it.

If I had success with it for my POIS, and no alternative, I would limit myself to a dose of 25mg, and use it only once or twice a week just before release.   I would avoid regular or daily use, for sure.

On the natural product side, which, as you may know, are my favorite choices, I would use, as an alternative, a combo of quercetin, bromelain, luteolin, stinging nettle, vitamin C , and Moducare ( I have already posted about this wonderful natural product, on the forum).   I already uses quercetin/bromelain, vitamin C, and artichoke extract ( as a luteolin source), and they work good for allergies or nasal inflammation, whenever I have those symptoms.  Quercetin and bromelain is part of my pre-pack, and I also use it after sport.   All those are natural products with usually no side effects at normal doses, so they are safe, even in the long run 


 ( nanna avoid quercetin and other mast cells stabilizers over concern about fertility and ejaculate volume, but I think it may be the other way around - a study found higher pregnancy rate in a group of men taking mast cells blockers - see part 8 of the following study: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/232810157_Male_infertility_A_critical_review_of_pharmacologic_management )

[fathom]

Thanks nanna1 (and all folks here).  I am a visual person, so intrigued by the schematic and I have been studying it quietly.   But since I am mentally challenged on medical topics:

Q: POIS is caused by (under this theory) due to both Norepinephrine AND Histamine storm, or one or the other?

Q: In your solution stack, you include anti-histamine but you dont include norepinephrine reducers? (though you do have a1A down-regulators, though thats not the same is it?).   

Q: Since my last POIS, I have started eating healthier and started taking Multi-vitamin (Centrum Men).  However for some reasons, my LPR symptom have returned with a vengeance and my voice has become hoarse.   I suspect, LPR got triggered (since I am getting a lot of throat clearing need immediately after eating, and some regurgitation of food into my esophagus till mouth) maybe after taking either Niacin, or Phosphatidyl Choline or Fenugreek or Taurine or perhaps its just the steamed vegetables I tried to switch to, instead of fastfood burgers/fries).  Any idea, if PC, Taurine or vitamins in Centrum have a negative correlation with LPR or GERD? 

Q: I am thinking to try with Omega-3. Out of your stack, correct me, it seems like SAM-e, Thiamine DiPhosphate are most important ones?

Q: Your stack, it must be taken on a regular basis? and not just before an ejaculation like 2 hrs prior to be effective? 

Hi fathom,

Yes, Allegra/Fexofenadine inhibits histamine-related allergies and inflammation. It is a 2nd generation antihistamine that blocks H1-histamine receptors. An explanation for how H1 receptors could affect POIS is found in the first post here.

[fathom]

~ bump, no one answered the above

by the way:
- going through another pois.  I hate niacin (only tried non flush yet), it so much brings down my mood, feels like burning eyelids/forehead.  Though admitting, I took niacin right after o (and not before).  Before this o.  I have been taking supplements, which generally I think have made me feel better, though has zero affected my pois: been taking Choline (PC and AGPC), EPA/DHA(Omega3), Quercetin/Bromelain, and Multi-vitamin for some time now.
- also discovered that I do experience, not related to pois, a kind of brain fog all the time, though mine is a little different.  I have an acutely small 'working memory' like holding information in mind and organizing/manipulating it.  Which affects my speech and sociability, like holding spontaneous conversations.

[Quantum]

~ bump, no one answered the above

Well, Fathom, most of your questions are clearly for Nanni, about his stack and method, so try to PM him about this, I cannot answer for him, obviously.

But by reading his previous posts, you will see that his stack is to be taken every day, not before O.  This way of doing things is different than my own method, which include the use of a pre-pack, not of a daily stack of supplements.

For your question about LPR/GERD, you have started too much new supplements at the same time, so it is hard for you to discern which one is worsening this condition.  you should test them one by one, and see which one is irritating for your stomach and throat.

[romies]

Q: Since my last POIS, I have started eating healthier and started taking Multi-vitamin (Centrum Men).  However for some reasons, my LPR symptom have returned with a vengeance and my voice has become hoarse.   I suspect, LPR got triggered (since I am getting a lot of throat clearing need immediately after eating, and some regurgitation of food into my esophagus till mouth) maybe after taking either Niacin, or Phosphatidyl Choline or Fenugreek or Taurine or perhaps its just the steamed vegetables I tried to switch to, instead of fastfood burgers/fries).  Any idea, if PC, Taurine or vitamins in Centrum have a negative correlation with LPR or GERD? 

Q: I am thinking to try with Omega-3. Out of your stack, correct me, it seems like SAM-e, Thiamine DiPhosphate are most important ones?

From my personal experience (a guy with under-methylation),

Multi-vitamin (Centrum Men) triggers GERD 80% of the time, mostly from the mineral part of the formulation, all those metal oxides: zinc, iron, copper oxide etc. Switching to a non-mineral multivitamin reduced GERD occurrence by 10x.  Multi-vitamin usually contains the cheapest/least -bioavailable variant of vitamins, so I have stopped taking them for a long time

Niacin is bad for GERD, because stomach acid secretion is turned on by histamine. To turn off stomach acid, your body need to get rid of the histamine, but niacin tends to use up most of the methyl-reserve, and stomach acid becomes a non-stop flow particularly at night.

Stop niacin and take SAMe should give you a quick fix on that. but don't take SAMe for more than 4-5 days without knowing whether your sulfur-metabolism pathway can handle it.

POIS is mostly likely related to histamine H3 receptor in the brain. we don't have any OTC med that work effectively on that yet.

NorE is not always bad for every POIS sufferer. In fact, for me, pseudoephrine (which raise NorE level in my brain) helps significantly to reduce my brain fog. Some people take Provigil or Nuvigil (you can search for those in the post from the past) for the same effect.