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Auto-Immune Causes and Treatments / Re: Maybe, that?s the fundamental reason behind POIS:
« Last post by gzbking on September 09, 2023, 12:16:42 PM »
NOTE: This is my theory about the origin of Pois i made on Reddit a few months ago. Because of the positive feedback, i wanna show you too. Maybe it can help us. Please give it a try:
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"Hi, im 27, from Germany. Got pois since im 12yo. Found out a few years ago, since then i searched and tried almost every treatment and 'cure'. With very good results. But one thing made me wonder everytime.

Why do the symptoms start again after a few ejaculations?

I mean, lets see what we already know about the treatments so far. They all try to fix an unhealthy gut or the deficits of nutritions/vitamins from it. Like we only fight against a 'leaky gut', 'bad microbiom' or 'candida'.

And indeed: all pois symptoms are entirely pointing to a defensive reaction from our immune system, the gut.

And also indeed: fighting against that made my own life worth living again, too.  The symptoms can get reduced till you think you have found the "cure!".

But still: Almost every cured person had a (1)comeback, (2)still to deal with some symptoms or at least (3)only a low frequency of O?s anymore.

So, isn't it strange that pois is directly linked to an orgasm? (Obviously...)

Like what exactly of this process leads to inflammation symptoms?

Isnt it more that we treat the inflammation symptoms and try to strengthens our immune system, which causes a successful relief, but no real end solution?

And are some longterm-aspects from pois like candida/food intolerance/YouNameIt only the result of a continuous weakened immune system?

Maybe we have to get an other perspective and look what could be the fundamental reason behind this bodyreaction. And I?ve found one...potentially at least...

A not functional "Blood-testis-barriere".

Maybe you also had the idea over time: What if our semen just get to regions of the body where it shouldn't be, so we suffer from an inflammation process for a few days.

So i googled "sperm in bloodstream" and found this answer in "":

"Blood testis barrier is a barrier present in our testis which prevents sperms to enter into blood and lymphatic circulation. Suppose, our ?blood testis barrier? has been damaged,so now there is no barrier to prevent sperms enter into the circulation. When sperms enter into the bloodstream, immune system will be activated, immune system will destroy those antigens(sperms).And immune system will make antibody against our own sperms (antigens) . If once antibody would be made then those antibody will enter into testis and will destroy all sperms and germ cell (from which sperms form).
So,like that,same process will be processed when you inject sperm in your bloodstream.But here antibody may not enter into testis from circulation because of ?blood testis barrier?,but it is sure that antibody will form against our sperm."

I mean, thats what an inflammation is: A exhausting and symptomsheavy cleaning process, trying to get rid of unwanted things in our bloodstream or anywhere else the stuff gets with it... It don't have to be a lot of it. Just particles are enough for some really heavy inflammation symptoms.

Most of us became pois with the beginning of puberty and the first real ejaculations, so it could be innate. But after all, that's all just ideas."

What do you think, guys?

could very well be something entering blood which shouldn't but its unlikely to do anything to the strength of your immune system, if you are living its working just fine and the fact we dont see any lupus like traits in pois it has to be something local, maybe if some poiser donate there body to science after there death we can finally check the anatomy for any anomalies in a 100 years we will have a answer to this question
Auto-Immune Causes and Treatments / Re: Lung inflammation / reduced absorption of oxygen
« Last post by gzbking on September 09, 2023, 12:05:00 PM »
Long time lurker and first time poster here. This may be long, but I'll keep it as short as possible...

So I've been suffering from this curse for as long as I can remember. I've tried countless supplements and tried addressing numerous theories including methylation, deficiencies, etc, you know them all. A lot of things like taurine, niacin, NSAIDs, etc, didn't help at all. I've noticed the supplements that did help me seemed to address the problems with inflammation and blood/blood circulation like omega 3s, methyl folate and B12, garlic oil. I will say that Ive been a lifelong sufferer of airborne allergies as well, and am all too familiar with what they do to the lungs and throat.
Now I bring that up because I feel like I've made a huge realization...

My current hypothesis is that orgasm causes an inflammation response in the body, but for my purposes here, it affects the lungs, and that lung inflammation reduces absorption of oxygen and that lowered oxygen level is at the core of this disease, at least for me.

I've always noticed a heaviness in my chest, phlegm in chest and throat, deep gravely voice, and a constant shortness of breath. I never paid much attention to it until a few days ago after I O'ed I had the same chest reaction and tried doing very long, deep, holding breaths to try to counteract that. And it helped, noticeably. So I O'ed again this morning and immediately started looking for changes in lung behavior and sure enough I immediately got the all the same lung changes that also happen when I encounter high doses of airborne allergens like dense pet dander and bug spray... The same reactions I now realize happen after orgasm.

Trouble absorbing oxygen can explain so many of the symptoms of this disease. The fatigue, lowered stamina, achy and weak muscles and joints, cognitive problems, shortness of breath... These can all be explained by lowered levels of oxygen. One thing that always happens to me in a POIS state is a certain feeling in my eyes. A Google search of lower oxygen level's effects on the eyes revealed this..."blurred vision, burning, excessive tearing and a scratchy feeling, almost like there is sand in the eye". This EXACTLY PERFECTLY describes how my eyes feel.

As I said, I've been doing really long, deep breaths as much as possible to get my oxygen into my blood and so far it's been helping. I'll continue to update as I build on this hypothesis.

My hope is to get ideas about this from others and see if anybody else wants to try their own experiments.

get your oxygen levels tested
Auto-Immune Causes and Treatments / Re: POIS caused dehydration? And water won?t help
« Last post by gzbking on September 09, 2023, 11:56:04 AM »
just get a kidney function test you fill see if you are loosing electrolytes, or if you mean you have low water content in general that means your kidney is leaking and thats pretty much unlikely and if drinking water is not helping then wtf is going on man
What is POIS / Re: POIS media coverage megathread
« Last post by less_fogged on September 09, 2023, 11:35:01 AM »

Use a youtube downloader to download and watch the video.

NSAIDs, high dose antihistamine therapy and SSRIs were considered ineffective.
Treatment: 3 months of therapy with 300 mg Omalizumab every 4 weeks. Patient had improvement of symptoms 3 days after start of therapy. I will add this to the pois paper treatment thread.

Very interesting case report !
Sadly, they do not share how they came to decide to try omalizumab ( Xolair) for POIS.  It is an allergic asthma treatment, and also treats urticaria (hives). The patient's symptoms were nausea and a decline of cognitive functions, starting 5 minutes after O, and his blood tests were normal, so I wonder how the immunology department came to this decision.

Xolair works essentially by depleting free IgE antigens. so that basophils, mast cells, and dendritic cells are gradually down-regulated.  This case report goes in line with the last article of the late Dr. Waldinger, that POIS is an auto-immune disorder.

Has anyone been able to get hold of the article from the youtube video using omalizumab ( Xolair) for POIS ?
I wish I could test this medication seems promising but expensive.
Used by injections. The standard price for one of these injections costs more that 200euros or even close to about 250euros. Medical healthcare pays most of it back here in my country for those suffering from severe asthma. But if you have POIS then you must pay the full amount!  Part of our problem is that we still don't have a proper diagnoses for POIS.
A Proper diagnoses would be such an advantage and this alone does not seem fair. Many people get help with their illnesses from government, but if you have POIS everything is cut down and often left in the dark with administration. My doctor recognises that I have POIS but can not organise me all the benefits that I'd normally be entitled to get because of these administrative issues with POIS! :(
Interesting. If I take anti-histamines with pseudoephedrine they are more effective than anti-histamines alone (ie Allegra-D). Pseudoephedrine is a norepinephrine releasing agent.

"Pseudoephedrine acts on ?- and ?2-adrenergic receptors" Ref

Activation of ?2-adrenergic receptors on mast cells is the primary pathway for adrenergic agents to inhibit mast cells.

Table 1 and chapter 5: Neuroendocrinology of mast cells: Challenges and controversies

Milnacipran is used for fibromyalgia and fibromyalgia is associated/comorbid with mast cell activation disease.

what does this mean androgenic agent, is it means androgenic hormones like testosterone, its a molecule without bonds required to analyze a protein so it wont be interacting with a mast cell receptor, unless something went very wrong
The Down Side / Re: Latest Ideas on NE Avoidance
« Last post by Quantum on September 09, 2023, 11:14:22 AM »

Did the internist or the urologist tell you before the procedure that you had a varicocele or a dilated vein in the scrotum?
If not, I wonder what link there would be between this procedure and NEs

There was no talk about me having a varicocele or a dilated vein in the scrotum
I just remember telling him that NEs was a big part of my POIS problem and so he came up with the idea that with this procedure would simply stop me getting NEs.
Too bad, I would have liked to know how he figured out that this procedure would help to stop NEs.
Can you help me understand if Quercetin raises or lowers vitamin b6 and b12 ? and how much ?

I seem to remember a website where it was said they were lowered but I can't find it anymore.
I have found here
that it inhibits CYP3A4, don't know if it matters
To my knowledge, there is no interaction between vitamin b6 and b12, and quercetin.

CYP3A4 is not an issue with B vitamins, but there will be an interaction with the drugs eliminated by this liver enzyme.  However, quercetin is only a weak inhibitor fo CYP3A4 ( see for details)

Thank you. I asked because last year I developed a neuropathy (electric zap in 1 foot and a feeling of light internal trembling all over the body) after consuming an excessive amount of vitamin B6.
I was extremely worried when those symptoms started. I consumed 50mg a day which seemed very safe according to the US FDA daily upper limit of 100 mg, but later I found out that in Europe the upper limit is only 25mg and in UK even lower at just 10mg, so there seem to be major concerns about this Vitamin B6 which incredibly the US FDA doesn't know/understand.

Luckily my neuropathy resolved after some months but I have been in contact with people with B6 toxicity who had it for years and can't get out, like a neurological permanent damage.  :-\  :-\

So I'd like to try quercetin for my POIS but after reading it might create tingling/neuropathy I am a bit worried. I have also found out quercetin significantly inhibits iron absorption, which by itself can create anemia and neuropathy, yes I guess this can be fixed by iron supplements but overall I am bit worried.

this is very hard to figure out, first what do you mean by neuropathy its not a description of anything

were u getting ticks in your muscles
were you getting irregular contraction of muscles
were u experiencing temperature differently it hot is cold cold is hot
were u getting pins and needles
did u had pain in muscle after that
was it electricity that you feel from the socket or is it more like a pressure on your blood vessel
did you get any bruising on skin after that
did your skin went numb
did your skin got painful
were you dehydrated/did you had too much salt
do you have any other disease

and is quercetin an iron antagonist, is it even in a active form to occupy iron absorbing receptor in the intestine probably no. are there iron antagonist yes tea and coffee are iron antagonist cause they pass though stomach acid much faster and retain active compounds more so it depends did you consume quercetin in a liquid form on an empty stomach even then we dont know even if its present in high enough doses in your diet. if you are consuming it with food not with any other iron antagonist, its unlikely to affect iron absorption enough to cause iron deficiency

and is b6 neurotoxic could be, it depends even more
what kind of neuro toxicity - inhibitor
is it a b6 receptor antagonist - no
is it a demyelanating agent - no
is it a autophagic agent of neurons - no
is it a receptor binding agent of a neuron and if so which neuron - no
is it inhibitor of a neuron receptor - yes
is it neuron receptor binding agent - no

whats b6's half life and how are you consuming it in the first place if from food its probably not nerotoxic

if from supplement b6 as a inhibitor can prevent signals to pass through a nueron effectively, what will be the result, some signals wont pass, will it disable the neuron no, will it bind it its receptors no, will it demylate the neuron no, what kind of symptoms will you get :-
spasms, inability to control muscles accurately, alcohol like effect on movement, dizziness, foggy vision,numb or enhanced effect on senses ie temperature, touch, hearing, could experience some tick like movement, no electrical shocks, no cognitive symptoms, no metabolic symptoms, upset stomach, usually no cardiac symptoms

so what kind of neuro toxicity does it produce can it be permanent yes but unlikely how fast can you recover from it within 24 hours, could it have permanent damage on your neurons unlikely but possible, can you get electric shocks from this kind of inhibitor well very very unlikely but yes(its most most probably not from this) it could be you actually had ingested another neuro toxin along with b6 which caused the electric shock

this is only for education not anything official
The Down Side / Re: Latest Ideas on NE Avoidance
« Last post by less_fogged on September 09, 2023, 11:03:07 AM »

Did the internist or the urologist tell you before the procedure that you had a varicocele or a dilated vein in the scrotum?
If not, I wonder what link there would be between this procedure and NEs

There was no talk about me having a varicocele or a dilated vein in the scrotum
I just remember telling him that NEs was a big part of my POIS problem and so he came up with the idea that with this procedure would simply stop me getting NEs.
this works best, but if you are addicted to porn or have a sexual partner its hard to not orgasm for that long and you should learn to deal with pois in younger years so you can have a healthy relationship i lost 3 gf's cause of pois and a lot of years of my life, so i recommend you learn to deal with it early cause you can get in serious trouble or be ill equipped to deal with self independence or a relationship in your 30's, this is my plan to just avoid orgasms in later years of my life when i dont need to have sex anymore.
This might be obvious but I guess it's overlooked by most people. I overlooked it myself for a long time until this year.

I have tried many treatments, some with good results, but nothing is as good as no orgasm.
Attention, I don't mean no sex or no masturbation, Actually You can have sex as many times as you want and masturbation as many times as you want, you just have to avoid orgasm for a proper amount of time.

For me having only 1 orgasm every 3-4 weeks seems to be the perfect balance, pois is reduced to basically zero and I feel great the whole time, always, with a level of clear mind and attention which is stunning compared to previously.

Sorry for my english, it's not my first language.
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