Post Orgasmic Illness Syndrome (P.O.I.S.)

POIS Cause/Treatment Discussions => Investigation Areas => Topic started by: Muon on March 28, 2018, 06:13:03 PM

Title: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on March 28, 2018, 06:13:03 PM
I'm interested in the parameters poiscenter members would choose if they had to pick some from this lab:

http://www.imd-berlin.de/labor.html

Go through the catalog on the right side depicted by the alphabet. What do YOU want to see me get tested on? Make a list and show it. This is not much of a discussion thread on my part so I won't argue with the choice you made.
Do you want me to test these before and/or after an orgasm and after what time period. Those markers with ''nur im Rahmen von klinischen Studien'' are too expensive and is no option. Use the original german language page because the translated versions of that site may show incomplete lists (or switch between them).

Use the following sites for finding interesting papers/info about the parameter in question:
(Type in the parameter and a symptom for example and read some abstracts)

https://scholar.google.com

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page

Even if you rarely post on this forum input would be appreciated (forum lurkers included).
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: nanna1 on March 29, 2018, 11:49:50 PM
Hi Muon,

Some of these might be good test to get:

Granulocyte colony stimulating factor (GM-CSF), RANTES and IP-10 are chemokines (cytokines) that attract T cells to the site of an activated infection. (https://academic.oup.com/jid/article/186/Supplement_2/S171/2191269#89857105) GM-CSF, RANTES and IL-8 are released whenever JNK (herpes activating gene) is activated. (immediately before and after)
NMDA-Rezeptor-AAk and AMPA receptor AAk can help determine if there is Autoimmune encephalitis in the brain. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoimmune_encephalitis#Post_herpes_simplex_NMDA_antibody_encephalitis)
Progesterone is the major anti-inflammatory hormone.
MTHFR genotyping might be useful since herpes viruses require methylation to stay dormant.
Kynurenine is an indirect measure of PGE2 production (and vitamin B6 deficiency). IDO expression is controlled by COX-2 (AA/COX-2/PGE2/IFN-g/IDO).
IL-12 and IL-2 are involved in the communication between T-helper cells, macrophages and NK cells.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: ThisType on March 31, 2018, 09:46:22 PM
I don't know the symptoms you're seeing but from my perspective (cluster 1 symptoms), I would want to test choline and related metabolites as well as other b vitamin levels.  A number of people find relief with choline. I've listed a few thoughts here :
http://poiscenter.com/forums/index.php?topic=2486.0

Some of the tests run to determine choline levels are here: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2637180/#FN1
It is not clear to me if they are standard lab tests (I would be interested to know as well). The closest I could find on the lab site you list is not an exact match:
http://www.imd-berlin.de/en/subject-information/diagnostics-information/b-vitamine-messung-der-bioaktivitaet-mittels-id-vitr-test.html
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Hopeoneday on April 03, 2018, 09:56:39 AM
Hi muon, did you tested for autoimune hepatitis?
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on April 03, 2018, 10:14:47 AM
No, but I have been tested for Hepatitis B, C and E because of elevated ALAT and ASAT. If you take a look at the auto anti-bodies page from my dropbox you will see a few of them being used in the diagnosis of autoimmune hepatitis but these are all negative.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Quantum on April 04, 2018, 04:04:04 PM
I didn't check for availability on the lab site you have linked to, Muon, but I would certainly see some of these being tested, because they are elevated in MCAS ( Mast Cells Activation Syndrome):

tryptase,
N-methyl histamine,
prostaglandin D2 or 11-beta- prostaglandin F2 alpha,
leukotriene E4

Also,  pro-inflammatory cytokines level would be interesting to test.

As noted by Romies in another thread, it is a problem that brain concentrations cannot be tested, otherwise, I would be very, very interested in checking kynurenine concentrations in brain during POIS,   I would specifically like to know if quinolinic acid and kynurenic acid concentrations in the brain are up during POIS, since I believe they are responsible for the glutaminergic excitotoxicity , and respectively cognitive, and emotional symptoms, in POIS.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Hopeoneday on April 13, 2018, 03:50:15 PM
I advice to test if this is posible test at all.
Leky gut(gut permeability).
Food intolerances and alergy.
Hawy metal toxyticy.
And this https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4712273/
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on July 08, 2018, 09:34:00 AM
I'm placing this here for the sake of overview, it's from a conversation between me and Bletzer via private mail. He said:
''A good marker to see if you're lectin sensitive is to check if you have high levels of adiponectin''

I advice to test if this is posible test at all.
Leky gut(gut permeability).
I did do a test where I had to swallow a liquid with indigestible molecules to see if there were 'holes' in the intestines. The result was negative. Can't remember what substance it was, I can't find the document.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on July 09, 2018, 09:30:57 AM
Another suggestion:
''Hi Muon,

There is a urinary 5-HIAA test (random) which may be cheaper than the serum tests for serotonin. You may like to check it if it is indeed cheaper in your country.

I think this test will indicate if we have enough production of serotonin. It's usually used to diagnose serotonin based tumours, i.e. the case of overproduction of serotonin.''
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: nanna1 on July 09, 2018, 08:30:40 PM
I'm placing this here for the sake of overview, it's from a conversation between me and Bletzer via private mail. He said:
''A good marker to see if you're lectin sensitive is to check if you have high levels of adiponectin''

I advice to test if this is posible test at all.
Leky gut(gut permeability).
I did do a test where I had to swallow a liquid with indigestible molecules to see if there were 'holes' in the intestines. The result was negative. Can't remember what substance it was, I can't find the document.
Hi Muon,
Was the liquid you swallowed lactulose and mannitol dissolved in water (https://www.gdx.net/product/intestinal-permeability-assessment-urine)?
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on July 10, 2018, 08:27:16 AM
Was the liquid you swallowed lactulose and mannitol dissolved in water (https://www.gdx.net/product/intestinal-permeability-assessment-urine)?
Yes
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on December 30, 2018, 12:14:01 PM
I'm thinking about testing a few standard sex hormones. When should I test these when POIS symptoms are minimized or after ejaculation? I can also have moments or bursts where I feel I'm hypersexual I could wait for such moment but it's quite difficult to plan ahead for. I only want to test them once:
https://www.prescan.nl/onderzoek/laboratoriumonderzoek-v2/bloedonderzoeken/hormonen-man/
https://www.prescan.nl/onderzoek/laboratoriumonderzoek-v2/bloedonderzoeken/hormonen-vrouw/
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on December 30, 2018, 12:26:16 PM
I'm thinking about testing a few standard sex hormones. When should I test these when POIS symptoms are minimized or after ejaculation? I can also have moments or bursts where I feel I'm hypersexual I could wait for such moment but it's quite difficult to plan ahead for. I only want to test them once:
https://www.prescan.nl/onderzoek/laboratoriumonderzoek-v2/bloedonderzoeken/hormonen-man/
https://www.prescan.nl/onderzoek/laboratoriumonderzoek-v2/bloedonderzoeken/hormonen-vrouw/

Honestly Muon as much tests that you can do as possible the better. However, lets put priority on test post orgasm, then another before orgasm and then later when you are sexually active if you want to do that.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on December 30, 2018, 12:31:29 PM
The problem is that I cannot test them seperately. I need to buy the whole package as in the link. Cost me tons of money if I test them multiple times. Hmmm will think about it.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on December 30, 2018, 12:33:50 PM
The problem is that I cannot test them seperately. I need to buy the whole package as in the link. Cost me tons of money if I test them multiple times. Hmmm will think about it.
Prioritize post orgasm for now. I wish more members would follow your lead with doing tests so we can have a larger data-base. 
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on December 30, 2018, 12:47:27 PM
The problem is that I cannot test them seperately. I need to buy the whole package as in the link. Cost me tons of money if I test them multiple times. Hmmm will think about it.
Prioritize post orgasm for now. I wish more members would follow your lead with doing tests so we can have a larger data-base.
I need better argumentation than that although I appreciate your input Nas. For example if you look at Interferon gamma which is high outside POIS but wil get surpressed after orgasm and shifts into the normal referance range. My point is that perhaps some parameter might be high or low but only in a certain situation.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Vandemolen on December 30, 2018, 12:55:23 PM
I'm thinking about testing a few standard sex hormones. When should I test these when POIS symptoms are minimized or after ejaculation? I can also have moments or bursts where I feel I'm hypersexual I could wait for such moment but it's quite difficult to plan ahead for. I only want to test them once:
https://www.prescan.nl/onderzoek/laboratoriumonderzoek-v2/bloedonderzoeken/hormonen-man/
https://www.prescan.nl/onderzoek/laboratoriumonderzoek-v2/bloedonderzoeken/hormonen-vrouw/
You can save money if you ask your doctor for a blood test. Your health insurrance will cover it.

I did already these test trough my doctor. It was in POIS.
Testosterone: 9.6 (in 2016). RR: 10-30
Free testosterone: 378 (in 2011). RR: 174-729
SHBG: 12 (in 2011). RR: 13-71
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on December 30, 2018, 01:04:19 PM
What are you going to test for particularly Muon?
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on December 30, 2018, 01:30:55 PM
What are you going to test for particularly Muon?
Nothing in particular just some standard set of sex hormones like testosterone, SHBG, prolactin, estrogen etc. I can't remember I have been tested for sex hormones. Since many forum members have abnormal values in these it is quite a logical step to check them in my case. Thanks for the input Vandemolen. I already agreed with my GP that if my Lp-PLA2 is elevated he would refer me to a specialist for investigation of endothelial dysfunction. If I ask him about hormone tests than that would be too much for now and could work against me. I always feel balancing on a thin line of credibility here.

The only hormones that have been tested numerous times are thyroid hormones. Probably because of temperature sensitivity. But I'm beginning to think that low temperature might actually inhibit acetylcholinesterase, but that's for another discussion.

For Lp-PLA2 I need to go to Berlin again. If I go to Berlin then I want to test more than that alone. Since I'm in winter season and feeling better than summer I wonder if symptom intensity is related to more change in abnormal parameter values and question myself whether it's therefore wise to do it now or wait for summer. Also they have a ton of new parameters in Berlin, look at all these interleukins (https://www.imd-berlin.de/nc/leistungsverzeichnis.html?tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Bsearch%5D=&tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Babc%5D=I&tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Baction%5D=list&tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Bcontroller%5D=Analyse&cHash=9a34e379ddc4c52fde03e9791add530b) for example.  Eventually they will be available to the public but it will take time and I could wait for that. Most things that are on my prioritiy list are only available for group studies like substance P, ICAM, VCAM, P-selectin, endothelin, MMPs, acetylcholinesterase, IL-12 etc.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Vandemolen on December 30, 2018, 01:56:39 PM
What are you going to test for particularly Muon?
Nothing in particular just some standard set of sex hormones like testosterone, SHBG, prolactin, estrogen etc. I can't remember I have been tested for sex hormones. Since many forum members have abnormal values in these it is quite a logical step to check them in my case. Thanks for the input Vandemolen. I already agreed with my GP that if my Lp-PLA2 is elevated he would refer me to a specialist for investigation of endothelial dysfunction. If I ask him about hormone tests than that would be too much for now and could work against me. I always feel balancing on a thin line of credibility here.

The only hormones that have been tested numerous times are thyroid hormones. Probably because of temperature sensitivity. But I'm beginning to think that low temperature might actually inhibit acetylcholinesterase, but that's for another discussion.

For Lp-PLA2 I need to go to Berlin again. If I go to Berlin then I want to test more than that alone. Since I'm in winter season and feeling better than summer I wonder if symptom intensity is related to more change in abnormal parameter values and question myself whether it's therefore wise to do it now or wait for summer. Also they have a ton of new parameters in Berlin, look at all these interleukins (https://www.imd-berlin.de/nc/leistungsverzeichnis.html?tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Bsearch%5D=&tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Babc%5D=I&tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Baction%5D=list&tx_ajdiagnostics_analyse%5Bcontroller%5D=Analyse&cHash=9a34e379ddc4c52fde03e9791add530b) for example.  Eventually they will be available to the public but it will take time and I could wait for that. Most things that are on my prioritiy list are only available for group studies like substance P, ICAM, VCAM, P-selectin, endothelin, MMPs, acetylcholinesterase, IL-12 etc.
I have the opposite. During summer I can have 1 O in a week and no major problems. During winter 1 O. will make me sick for weeks. I am abstaining for 2 months now. I think I will add at least 2 months more. Good luck with the tests. The more parameters we test the better we can at least manage our POIS.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on December 30, 2018, 02:10:04 PM
The more parameters we test the better we can at least manage our POIS.
But therein lies the problem. There is hardly any 'we'. One person testing for things and then what? What is the reason you don't put any effort into privately funded blood tests if I may ask?
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on December 30, 2018, 03:16:49 PM
The more parameters we test the better we can at least manage our POIS.
But therein lies the problem. There is hardly any 'we'. One person testing for things and then what? What is the reason you don't put any effort into privately funded blood tests if I may ask?
I wish if the same th1/th2 tests were to be done by someone who did not go through desensitization. I can't personally check that right now, I'd have to get to Baghdad and special order them. Maybe you do the sex hormones thing and if one comes out abnormal I'll do a test about it.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Vandemolen on December 30, 2018, 03:21:49 PM
The more parameters we test the better we can at least manage our POIS.
But therein lies the problem. There is hardly any 'we'. One person testing for things and then what? What is the reason you don't put any effort into privately funded blood tests if I may ask?
I already spend a lot of money on tons of vitamins I have tried and still do. Because of my urticaria I also spend a lot of money in all kinds of things used in the bathroom (shampoo etc.).

I already checked of lot of things. After you maybe I am the one with the longest list. Those tests were by prescription of my doctor. I think 50% of the things that were checked was because I asked my doctor. Vitamin D, testosterone, thyriod, etc. Now I want to know if I have a vitamin B problem. So that is what I am gonna ask for the next time.

If I think I have to do a test that is not covered by my health insurrance I consult my doctor first. For example checking candida. He said it is obvious that I have candida because he checked me. So it would be a waste of money to do a test of something I already know. We also spoke about a gen mutation test MTHFR. He said it would be worth while to test it. I did not because I read an artcile in tye NY Times about privacy problems.

But I am spending a lot of my money because of POIS. And beside that I had a lot of costs (personal reasons). Before that I would buy every vitamin that someone on this forum found relief from. I think I tried more than 100 vitamins.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on January 01, 2019, 09:32:03 PM
Hey Muon, I'm curious about Vasopressin. Perhaps take a test pre-orgasm?
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Muon on January 02, 2019, 02:54:14 PM
Hey Muon, I'm curious about Vasopressin. Perhaps take a test pre-orgasm?
Why vasopressin?
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on January 02, 2019, 03:17:37 PM
Hey Muon, I'm curious about Vasopressin. Perhaps take a test pre-orgasm?
Why vasopressin?
It's a hormone that drops down after Ejaculation.
Title: Re: Parameter input from members
Post by: Nas on January 02, 2019, 04:27:46 PM
Oxytocin is another one I'm curious about. I feel that I become better when seeing a girl I have a crush on.